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    Active GD-The results of the National Education Policy 2020 will be positive- Agree or disagree?

    The Union Cabinet has, on 29th July '20, passed the new National Education Policy (NEP) with an aim to revamp and reform the existing education system from the school to the college level in the country. One of the highlighted points in the new policy is the decision to rename the Ministry of Human Resources and Development as the Ministry of Education. Many major and minor reforms have been introduced in the structure of education as well as examinations. Some of the proposals include suggesting primary education in one's mother-tongue, making way for entry of foreign universities, easier board examinations and restructuring the mode of assessing students etc. One of the main aims of revising the old policy is said to be to make our education system more contemporary and skill oriented.

    Keeping the relevance and importance of the new policy in mind and also considering the changes that have been proposed to be implemented, we are announcing this Active GD on the topic- The results of the National Education Policy 2020 will be positive- Agree or disagree? ?

    While discussing the topic, you may compare the old policy with the new one, discuss the practical aspects, the possibilities and impossibilities, the implementation part and so on. We need to understand that formulating or announcing a policy will be immaterial if the proposals cannot be implemented with the same passion which means that the point of implementation also will form a part of the discussion.

    We are looking forward to a practical and serious discussion on the topic. Let us not be influenced by perceptions or inhibitions. A sincere suggestion is to avoid politicizing the point of discussion though political interests or intentions are not a taboo as such. We do not expect the participants to perform a critical analysis of the proposals one by one but to form their arguments based on the policy generally, its viability or otherwise and the likely outputs.

    General guidelines for adherence – (Please read and follow them strictly)

    *Please do not post responses that are not relevant to the GD in this thread.
    *Read and understand the topic properly before coming up with arguments.
    *Please stick to the topic. Do not deviate from the main subject. It is quite natural to draw connections or make references but one must make it a point to get back to the topic of discussion. Any deviation from the main topic that is likely to affect the flow of a discussion is not advisable. Take a stand and fight for it and avoid trying to maintain a balance.
    *Do try to add on or elaborate on points already submitted instead of harping on the same point in different words time and again. It would be better if you distribute your arguments between the responses you intend to post instead of covering up all of them in one go. Please give detailed responses with valid points to support your argument.
    *Do not get personal. Each participant in a debate is free to choose his stand and though one can and has to challenge and try to disprove another's point, it should be limited to the views only and not on a personal level. Let us not discard dignity and decency for the sake of cementing a view.
    *All the posting guidelines as per the policy of ISC are applicable in this GD too. Any violation thereof will not be acceptable.

    Let us have a healthy, active and fruitful discussion. The GD will close on the 03rd of August 2020.

    Best participants selected will be awarded a cash reward of Rs 150/- each. Other participants will also be considered for cash rewards if found eligible.

    Note: The editor who is moderating the GD will have the final say (in consultation with the team) in matters of dispute (during discussion) and a point or guidance put forth as a response by the moderator need not be responded to by the participating members.

    Important - Members may please note that considering the importance of the topic that is being discussed and also the fact that the NEP has been introduced just a day back, we have decided to keep this announcement thread locked for responses till 1630 hrs tomorrow. This is to enable interested members to go through the proposals and to make necessary preparations to come up with meaningful and valuable arguments to support their stand.

    Read the requirements carefully, think properly and logically and get ready to start penning down your points and arguments. The thread will be opened for discussion tomorrow evening!

    Mr Mohan who had raised a thread on the topic much before we could bring it down on paper will be credited Rs 15/- and 15 points to his thread as a mark of appreciation.
  • #706166
    Here goes the long whistle. Get, Set, Go...
    “It is better to change an opinion than to persist in the wrong one." – Socrates

  • #706167
    I welcome the GD topic as it is a latest and relevant topic for ISC and thank the Lead Editor to seize the opportunity and Mohan for giving the topic clue in this regard. The matter is definitely going to be debated not only in this site but all over the country.

    Though I would have liked to analyse all dimensios and come with a truthful and unbiased stand, as it is mandated in the guidelines,that participants hsould not take a balanced view but to take a dedicated one side stand, I also have to follow that for this GD.

    So on the GD topic question"The results of the National Education Policy 2020 will be positive- Agree or disagree?" I am with DISAGREE.

    My take on NEP 2020 is nothing but a dream peddled in verbose, old wine in new bottle and marketed in a very wrong time. It is just a verbal exercise aiming to impress the vast section of the confused youth and not-so-updated parents too.

    I shall make my stand clear with explanations in coming posts during discussion.

    I welcome particpants to have a fruitful discussion onthis GD.

  • #706182
    Thanks to ISC for opening a good platform for all the members to express their thoughts on the newly proposed National Education policy 2020. This revision is coming after 34 years. In 1986 there was a national education policy implemented. After a long gap, the union government has come up with a new policy proposal.

    I say this is a positive move and if the proposals are implemented in their true spirits we are going to see a good change in the students coming out of the institutes. The skillset of the students will be more and they will be user friendly. So I say the proposed system is a positive step in the right direction.

    The committee headed by ex ISRO Chairman Mr Katuri Rangan gave the report to the government and it got the approval from the ministry and now it is to be implemented.

    There are many positive points in the scheme and they are going to make a positive impact on the education system. Our students can compete with the international student community who are coming out from prestigious institutions. Indian students need not think of going to foreign countries to have quality education and the institutions will come here to help the students here in our country.

    drrao
    always confident

  • #706186
    I would say 'Negative". Such a major policy decision should have been tabled in the parliament and discussed with all the highly educated opposition leaders who would have suggested more to add this NEP 2020. An unilateral decision will have a negative impact though it looks good now.
    Let me hear the other member's view to discuss further.

    No life without Sun

  • #706194
    Good evening everyone. Indian education system is one of the most rigid and sternest. Syllabuses, structures and educational outlook rarely change in our country. My cousins who studied decades ago, have studied more than I did. Subjects have with time become briefer and concise. Concepts have been merely reduced to facts.
    Finally with the pandemic situation, education system has lost its rigidity and once offered to be flexible. Skills will now be taught at a younger age. Rote learning may die hard still. Vocational and choice based subjects will be introduced early on.
    All of this sounds fantastic on paper. This kind of learning is compatible with the ever present covid situation right now. Even for years to come this pandemic has left us scarred. A system as flexible as this one, is especially constructed for situations like this.
    I really welcome this new educational reform.

    The stronger a light shines the darker are the shadows around it.

  • #706197
    The one point which will make this system more useful is " Vocational education will start in schools from the sixth grade and will include internships." This will give a chance to the student to learn job skills.

    As a person from the industry, I know the problems that are being faced by the industry. No Engineer who can work on a machine with his hand is not available these days. A fresh engineer from college will come to the industry and stare at a machine and ask the technician working on that about the machine. This is the present situation.

    Now if the students are offered to go for a vocational education he will start knowing about the machine and he can also work with a machine if necessary. Some may ask why an engineer should work on a machine? An engineer who can work on a machine can only solve the practical problems that are arising in day to day working. So the skills are more important and an attempt towards that is made in this system. So if this is maintained and all the students are given a chance to have an internship from 6th class they can do a better job and they will have more value on their head.

    drrao
    always confident

  • #706203
    #1.
    I give a thumbs-up to the new Education Policy(NEP) though it looks tough to be implemented at this time. As mentioned by DR.N.V. Srinivasa Rao(#706182) revision is coming after 34 years, the policy looks good and in lines with the foreign country education policy that will help our students to have a concentration on the core subject of their interest than having to study every subject.

    Implementing the policy will require thorough knowledge and understanding but the policy made looks good and matching with international standards like that of other countries. I do know about education policy in the Philippines and I had mentioned it as a comment and this looks like matching with there which will help every student to have a certification in hand and get job accordingly than just wasting time if they drop out in the middle of a course.

    “The most important thing in life is to learn how to give out love, and to let it come in." — Morrie Schwartz

  • #706241
    I agree with the new educational system as a change us always necessary.
    Choosing if subjects from class 8th itself give them an aim or goal to reach. This may be difficult at the initial stage but children learn to lay the first brick towards their success of attaining their goals. With proper guidance from teachers, letting them know their strengths and weakness can raise them as better citizens.

    Lead the leader

  • #706243
    I am also in the favour of the New Education Policy 2020. It is a revolutionary policy, which will give students to study multidisciplinary subjects of their choices. Otherwise in old system students were compelled to study in three streams sciences, commerce, and humanities. According to new education policy flexible subject options will be there if a student wants to study economics history with maths and science he can do which was not possible in old system. Students are free to study in their mother tongue. Now 5+3+3+4 system will be in place of10+2 system. Vocational training ( internship) and coding education will be given to students starting from class 6 like other developed countries. Self evaluation by students system will be there. 6% of GDP will be invested on education. One more important feature will be added that is credit teansfer. If a student has completed only one year of his graduation degree he will get certificate, if 2 years than diploma, 3 years degree and 4 years than research degree. Masters degree will be of one year if students have 4 year graduation degree and if he have 3 years graduation degree than masters degree will be of 2 years. Over all it is a good education policy.

  • #706244
    Let me put forward my viewpoint regarding the new education policy:

    Well, any new policy cannot be outrightly accepted or rejected. There remain some pros and cons. It is heartening to hear that the new education policy would be skill-based, but I have my doubts. Firstly, policymakers must create employment opportunities. Getting a skill-based education is useless if there is no job to rely upon in the future.

    Yes, the respected members who are in favour of the policy would counter me with the point that even the jobs are not available during the present education policy, which gives importance to rote learning. Yes, the employment vacancy is indeed less at present too, but knowledge of different subjects can fetch them some newer options to earn, but skill-based education will make the students have a one-track mind. In general, job options are quite less, so when knowledge is based only upon skill, then employment opportunities will be comparatively less. First jobs should be created that is the need of the hour.

    shampasaid

  • #706247
    Broadly I welcome the NEP 2020 which envisages great growth to every student either he want to stand on own or chose the right course at early time and get standard over it to bring in the career growth of his choice, For the first time the education policy has given impetus for the students to chose either skilled way of doing the work or go for further education on the steams concerned. Such kind of Industry friendly policy were absent in the past. And giving the importance to local language is one more highlight and thus one has to study English, Hindi and their mother tongue. I sincerely feel that I should revisit my school education and start new. One more happening from this year that the central government has removed learning of Chinese language from the syllabus and that is one more good decision and slap on the face of dragon country.
    K Mohan @ Moga
    'Idhuvum Kadandhu Pogum "
    Even this challenging situation would ease

  • #706268
    If I have to provide the answer in positive or negative then I would like to say "positive". Yes, in my opinion, the new education policy would certainly provide a good result in future. From the Independence of India, we have been implementing the education policy made by Lord Macaulay. The main of Lord Macaulay's education policy was to create a group of people who can serve the British and can make a group who can work in the office for the British. He also wanted to make a group of people who can be loyal to the British and hence he started English medium and the education policy according. Unfortunately, after Independence, we are continuously adopting that policy. Only some minor changes were made time to time but the main concepts were not changed in Lord Macaulay's policy.

    I support this policy due to many reasons. The first of all, I am in favour that Primary education should be imparted in the mother tongue. When I join the ISC, I had raised a thread related to the medium of instruction in primary level. Mr Sukh Dev sir had the answer in detail in that tread. Most of the scholars are in favour that the education up to primary level should be imparted in the local language or in the mother tongue and the NEP has made it clear that the eduction up to primary level would be imparted in Local language. So, I think I would be beneficial for the future generation.

    I would discuss the other points after reading the responses of other respected members in detail.

    Thank you very much Saji sir the start a GD for an important issue of the country which is related to education.

    Honesty is the best policy.

  • #706270
    Feeling happy to join the discussion and it's worth a topic to be discussed as the initiative taken by the Union Government is quite welcome. Years together the national education Policy became a voice of many and confined to various committees and studies and remained indecisive, may be due to the regional imbalances and the elected representatives not taking a serious concern of such a system to be adopted in the interest of the future of the nation. Change is inevitable and there may initial hiccups in new transformation. There would be obstructions too but we have to move on. We are living in a society where we have to perform or perish because of Globalization. We have to change with the time. See, it took 34 years to prepare a draft for National educational policy. When the world is moving with wind speed, we are yet to finalize a national Educational system. Where is the lacuna? Is it not the political will? Yes, it is. Someone promised to derive a system on this account during their Electioneering in 2014 and luckily returned to power in 2019 and so, the committee appointed by them could fare well in its job.

    With different patterns of examinations and systems that are being followed by various states, Education being a concurrent subject, the present education system has scattered into different directions and dimensions. The Indian student has become fond of Foreign education which he can't afford. The new policy is designed in such a way that it has brought out a uniformity throughout the country with flexibility in learning the languages. It is a quite welcome note that the Government has released the draft report and strongly vote for the recommendations and in favor of the new policy. There may be some corrections or suggestions needed for improvement but we can't oppose it because of some technicalities if any.

    I will continue my argument with additional points in support of the proposed new system in the succeeding responses.

    Regards,
    Jagdish

  • #706271
    #706244
    The New Education policy 2020 has been introduced with the aim to make India self-reliant. To fulfil this aim vocation training are being introduced from Class 6 onwards. However, only vocation training will not be there it will be in addition to the academic and technical education. To inculcate students from early stage this step will be very useful. In India people do not understand profession of a carpenter, electrician, and plumber good but in other countries they are equally important. By entering these vocational trainings and internship, students become more self reliant and will not see to others for jobs. They will have freedom and flexibility to choose a career according to their choice. Further, flexible subject options will also give freedom to choose a line.

  • #706279
    Shampa Sadhya Madam,
    If we have a skill in our hand that will come in handy for our living.
    Just an academic certificate can't get you a job. One should have a skill.
    If I know driving if there is no job I can work as a driver. These days a driver is earning more than graduate in cities. The government can make systems to provide loans to the needy. If I know how to operate a lather machine I can purchase a lather machine and do job work for other major industries which will give me a livelihood. So we should welcome the skill development part of the policy.

    Coming to the advantages of the proposed system is the flexibility in the system. Any year you can drop out with a certificate in your hand. In the present system if you study a degree for three years and if you fail in the final years you will be left with your intermediate qualification only. But in the proposed system ' Undergraduate education can be of three or four years with multiple exit options and appropriate certification.'
    After joining in Undergraduate course if you discontinue after the first year you will be obtaining a certificate course certificate. After the second year, it will be an advanced diploma. After 3rd-year bachelor's degree and after 4th year you will get a bachelor's with research.
    This is definitely good for the student.

    drrao
    always confident

  • #706280
    Some of the more brilliant features of this education policy according to me are:
    1. Sanskrit is projected to be one of the compulsory languages everywhere.
    2. Music and other arts are already taught in many private schools. I hope they will become more prevalent in the education system by 2030.
    3. IIT's education which is already first class, will become better.
    4. More emphasis on practical activities since childhood. My teachers would skip such activities right away in school. They would not be neglected now, hopefully.

    For now I want to discuss on how these four points lead to betterment of students.
    1. Sanskrit is mother of all North Indian languages. It will be warmly welcomed in North, but South which is against Hindi itself, might take longer to accept Sanskrit. Sanskrit ties to the Hindutva idea of the present regime, as Sanskrit is a medium of ancient Hindu texts. Sanskrit was taught to me only in my 10+2 years. With early introduction of Sanskrit, students will have more time in hands to perfect the language.
    2. Music and other art forms lead to increased creativity among students. A new India deserves that creative energy. Playing instruments lead to mental development and memory power increase.
    3. Will IITs still be relevant with new education policy? That is something I would like to debate on. GATE exam's structure has already been altered according to the new policy, by adding basic science subjects and other conceptual subjects like linguistics.
    This time even science, commerce and arts students can participate in GATE 2021 along with the regular engineer aspirants.
    4. Having more practical homeworks will make Indian education system sit on a similar bench as first world education systems. This is something that should have entered our system a long ago but rapid commercialisation of education had impeded any sort of practical activities. What are called Extra curricular activities will now be borne by the curriculum.

    The stronger a light shines the darker are the shadows around it.

  • #706309
    #2.
    SuN(#706186), as you have mentioned that such a major policy decision should have been tabled in the parliament and discussed with all the highly educated opposition leaders who would have suggested more to add this NEP 2020. A unilateral decision will have a negative impact though it looks good now. I too agree with you that any decision whether it is accepted or not should be formulated only after putting it up in front of people or at least in front of a panel that is well-versed with it and can make it much better but here I feel that we still have a chance of amendments that can help our students and education as a whole so it can be welcomed.

    Shampa Sadhya(#706244), As you mentioned that the employment vacancy is indeed less at present too, but knowledge of different subjects can fetch them some newer options to earn, but skill-based education will make the students have a one-track mind. You have rightly highlighted the fact that employment vacancy is indeed less at present and even in future there will not be much change but one advantage of skill-based education is that the students will know the practical way and can even work as self-dependent and earn a living. Secondly, as Dr.Rao mentioned that skill-based doesn't mean sticking to only that subject but they will still have other subjects but more focus(theoretical and practical) will be on their core subject instead of making children learn everything as compulsory.

    Some of the advantages of the new education policy are:
    - The NEP will have a 5(5 years of primary education)+3(3 years of the preparatory stage)+3(3 years of the middle stage)+4(4 years of secondary school), and the examinations will only be held for class 5th, 8th, and 12th.
    - The flexibility of picking a multi-disciplinary course of his/her interest like a combination of Maths with economics, Biology with accounts, History with chemistry, physics with french, etc as they desire or like.
    - The medium of instruction in all schools upto class 5 will be in local or regional or the mother tongue will help children learn their language and will be fluent in them as other countries have. This will preserve our own linguistic heritage.

    “The most important thing in life is to learn how to give out love, and to let it come in." — Morrie Schwartz

  • #706311
    The results of the National Education Policy 2020 will be positive- Agree or disagree? - Yes, I agree

    We should keep in mind that it is a 34 year old policy which has been changed now. Hence, I believe this move will have a positive impact because the situations and scenarios which we had 34 years back are not the same now. The changes made to the policy are in such a way so as to cope with the current needs and situations.

    There are certain points that stroked me while I was going through the details of NEP 2020. Those are:

    (1) Having a counselling service in all educational institutes. It is indeed a great move as it helps our students to get rid of the stress related and emotional issues they are facing. No student should be left behind due to the personal issues or situations he has to undergo. I think the stress related issues are more these days when compared to 34 years back. Now, that we have nuclear families, working parents with busy schedules, no siblings or close ones to share our emotions, spending most of our time indoors than with friends outdoors have lead to increase in emotional imbalances and stressful life. Taking this into consideration, having a reliable counselling service in their educational institution can help in the up bringing and mental development of the students, thereby helping them in their growth and career development.

    (2) The importance given to one's mother tongue and local language is another important factor that attracted me. I strongly believe that it is essential for one to know their mother tongue, atleast to speak. I have read somewhere that a kid understands things better if it is communicated to him/her in their mother tongue. Knowing any language is an added benefit, there is nothing to be ashamed of. As language is the medium of communication, let our students grow up learning various languages. I have come across certain parents who do not want their children to learn their mother tongue. That scenario has to be changed and equal respect should be given to all languages as they all serve the same purpose. Let us not pave way to destroy the local languages.

    (3) Among the top 100 universities across the world, selected ones will be facilitated to operate in India. Isn't this something that we have to support? Let our students get the opportunity to enroll themselves in the top universities if they wish to. Also, as more universities are set up in the country, employment opportunities will also increase. On the other hand, students from other parts of the world will enroll in these universities, this will help in spreading a mixed culture which will help our students to see the world as one, rather than having a narrow mind.

    Regards
    Chitra
    "Do not give up, things might not favour you always"

  • #706314
    The other most important part of education policy is to include vocational education from standards VI. It will really helpful in developing different types of skill amongst the students. The present education system provides degrees to the students but failed to develop skills amongst them.

    Unemployment is the biggest problem in India and the main reason for unemployment is our education policy. There is a lack of practical knowledge in the students even after doing engineering. So, we can see that many engineers are also not getting jobs. Every company needs different types of skills and these skills are not found in the students. The NEP also provides importance to the development of different skills in the students. So, it will really help in the development of the nation.

    Due to vocational education, the students will develop skill in his interested field and he will also be provided with a certificate for the same. So, he can do self-employment and also can provide jobs to needy people. So, the NEP will also help in economic development of India.

    I will post my other opinions in the next responses later.

    Honesty is the best policy.

  • #706316
    Flexibility of subject options will give more advantage to the students who wish to make their career in civil services because till date in the old system students were used to select a stream from the three i.e. Science, Commerce and Arts. And if he select science stream still he has to read history and political science subject which demands extra efforts. But after this new education policy, students can choose subjects according to their choice and career target. They can choose science with history or any other subject.

  • #706317
    Someone said that if there is no job opportunities then what's the use of getting skill education and training. Probably from four years from now ie 2024 many skilled persons would come out of the schooling if the new NEP 2020 takes off with right earnest. So we have four good years to develop study oriented Industries on which the skill training is given. Moreover some trades are general to which the students can themselves work for themselves by having the service orientation for his future customers. One thing is sure, that the service Industry is poised for a great leap and we would have more skilled labour available from various state and they would be affordable too.
    K Mohan @ Moga
    'Idhuvum Kadandhu Pogum "
    Even this challenging situation would ease

  • #706318
    #706244
    I agree that our country is facing unemployment issues. But isn't it better if students in additional to the classroom theoretical knowledge, acquire some practical knowledge? That will help them in understanding the concepts better and in strengthening the knowledge. I believe practical knowledge is always better to achieve success in any given position, hence students with practical knowledge can shine later when they get a job.

    Also, I disagree with your point because we all started schooling with out having any assurance that we will be employed. Hence, the point policy makers need to create employment opportunities before amending the policy does not seem right to me.

    Secondly, no education is useless as we learn things not only to get a job, but also to have a better understanding of things and above all knowledge is wealth. I agree that learning only one skill will reduce the career opportunities of a person. But there is no point in learning those skills or subjects one has no interest in. It is as good as not learning. We will choose the skill we have interest in, hence we can be masters in it. Also, NEP 2020 provides students the option to choose any subject they like without having any stream barriers. Isn't that a good option?

    I would also like to add that no policy or education system is limiting the skills or subjects one can learn, he or she can learn as much as skills or subjects one needs to learn. It will make them versatile and will increase their exposure and chance in the job market. Also, skill based knowledge helps one to stand on their own rather than being dependent.

    Regards
    Chitra
    "Do not give up, things might not favour you always"

  • #706324
    I welcome to national education policy 2020. Due to the availability of many good schemes, I am in favour of this policy. The main motto of this policy to make India self-reliant. First thing I liked most that is to provide education in local language up to primary level. This policy also gives emphasis on skill-based education. There is great need, especially in India. In our country right from childhood people gives emphasis on taking only degree which oftentimes is of no use. Only having a degree leads to unemployment. Moreover, flexibility in choosing a subject would prove fruitful for students. By which student can make their carrier in any field.

  • #706325
    Another important point of this NEP2020 is the flexibility of subject selection. There will not be any fixed combinations and students can select any subject from a bunch of subjects.
    There will be no rigid separations between arts and sciences, between curricular and extra-curricular activities, between vocational and academic streams at the school or college level. The students are at liberty to choose the subjects. In the present system that flexibility is not there and there are some fixed combinations only from which the student has to select one combination. The student now can take his favourite subjects one from science. one from the arts and another one from extra circular activities like music.
    We all know that some foreign countries are learning Sanskrit and getting information from our epics and other Hindu books various information. But Indians are not able to do that as they are not having Sanskrit in their study subjects. Sanskrit to be offered at all levels of school and higher education as an option to the students including in three language formula. This is the best move and once the science and technology people can understand Sanskrit they can explore the information available in our ancient books. We all know that a Sanskrit Scholar helped ISRO in some of its missions by showing the information available in the Purana. That will be also going to make a big change in the mindset of the students.

    drrao
    always confident

  • #706333
    Now there can be one more major problem in our country. If more skilled people are at the disposal say after four years from now, the hectic and cut throat competition among themselves would also be cause of concern and there may be more works for some and nothing for many even though they know the same trade. Like in agriculture all the farmers would produce the same crops like tomato etc and when they do not find the price at the market, they try to dump the same on the road due to frustration. That kind of situation should not occur through this NEP 2020 which must have qualitative thrust and not quantitative pass outs.
    K Mohan @ Moga
    'Idhuvum Kadandhu Pogum "
    Even this challenging situation would ease

  • #706338
    Mohan, I think that competition for jobs will be there always. But if there are people with different skills they can search for the skill they have. A normal electrician in villages earn more than Rs,700/- per day and many people will be waiting for his appointment and he will be busy somewhere else. So the more you work hard the more you can earn. The concept of skill development will give the chance to have more employers and they can employ some people in their small establishment. As the population increases, the need for such skilled persons will also increase.
    drrao
    always confident

  • #706340
    Thanks for this GD: The results of the National Education Policy 2020 will be positive- Agree or disagree?
    It will help us to understand what has been introduced in the NEP2020. It was a much-awaited policy which has more or less have been mentioning here. My views about NEP2020
    Remember the scene from 3 Idiots in which Aamir Khan questions rote learning which doesn't allow for a deeper understanding of the subject?
    1. The NEP says that there would be an increase in the education budget in the yearly Budget to the extent of 6% of the GDP. Which has not been done in the last few budgets?
    2. At primary level education would be based on the mother-tongue or regional language. It is good in that the children would learn the mother-tongue easily. Disadvantage: The tender brain of a child understands and learns easily and therefore they can learn languages easily. English is the language of the world and if it is not being taught at an early level it will create problems for the kid which he/she grows up.
    3. Three language pattern: The three-language learned by children will be the choices of States, regions, and of the students, so long as at least two of the three languages are native to India. This is good point and would be advantageous.
    4. Vocational crafts such as carpentry, electric work, metal work, gardening, pottery making etc., to be introduced in 6-8 grades. Extra-curricular activities have already been there.
    5. NCC wing in secondary and higher secondary levels under Ministry of Defence. NCC has been there already.
    6. Digital and Online education system: The poor Indians living in small towns are struggling for mobile network and here the government wants to introduce online learning. I have seen during this lockdown that the teachers and the students both had tough time in coping up without erratic internet. Uneducated people like a rikshaw driver or a small time carpenter, etc could not understand how to help their kids in getting education online. They were forced to buy high-end mobiles (only industrialists have been benefitted with this not India). Digital payment has not been fully introduced in India even after years and we are given a new hope without scope.
    7. Foreign Universities: This NEP will allow coming of foreign universities to India. Great idea! Higher education has always been easier for the rich. The poor are not getting admission in the private schools (government has done nothing in this regard) will they be getting admission in these foreign universities? It is shame as India has been the land of learning with the famous Takashila and Nalanda Universities still remembered as the world famous universities from ancient India.
    8. Higher Education Commission of India (HECI) will be set up as a single overarching umbrella body for entire higher education, excluding medical and legal education. It seems that India is first time thinking about educating its people before this there was no planning for the higher education in India.
    9. Medium of instructions: The medium of instructions would be local/regional language. If we have to compete at global level, knowledge of English language is must.
    There are many other things in NEP2020 which have already been taken care-off.

    Regards,
    Nadeem Naqvi


    World without God is Zero without One!

  • #706345
    Mohan, I agree with you that more of skilled people will bring in more competition. But here we all are forgetting that there have been IITs at every level and there skilled training are being given. The NEP2020 seems to prove that there has nothing like skilled learning before this announcement.
    Dr. Rao, you have given your point in argument to Mohan. Here we are diverting from the main issue of learning to the issue of earning. There have been many skilled people and all are leading a handsome life.

    Friends, here in this GD I am reading the post of some members who are supporting the NEP2020 but not giving valid arguments.

    Coming to the introduction of Sanskrit language introduction. Ref (#706280) post of Mr. Aditya Mohan. Mr. Aditya I studied Sanskrit in 1982 at my school. Your comment is as if something new has been introduced. GD at ISC are always logical.

    Regards,
    Nadeem Naqvi


    World without God is Zero without One!

  • #706348
    @706338 I do agree that skilled persons always have the chance to get employed and paid nicely. But my perceptions is that when herds of such skilled students pass out from four years now, there would be more service workers and less jobs in hand and in that case the cost of doing the things would also come down. The imparting school must be strict in nurturing the skilled labors of future as they should not make urgency in passing all, but select of them who can be trusted and tried by the others who want the same services to be availed. Only future would tell the difference.
    K Mohan @ Moga
    'Idhuvum Kadandhu Pogum "
    Even this challenging situation would ease

  • #706353
    Nadeem Naqvi, It is good that you mentioned that learning is not for earning. But whenever we talk about education immediately we will say there are many educated people but there are no jobs. That is why I said that you can earn with your skills without thinking for a job.
    In a Telugu movie, there is a song in which the poet says what qualification the fish in the water to make it to swim in the water. It is not the education but the skill of swimming made it lead its life. In the same way, skills can give us chances to make a living.
    @ 706348, We are seeing the paucity of skilled workers and it will increase further as the population goes up further and hence I think having more skilled people is the necessity of the day. we are going to see the difference in future.

    drrao
    always confident

  • #706365
    Participants supporting the NEP2020 are extolling it which I find is undeserved.

    I have to say that there is nothing new in the NEP2020. A major part of the policy is those from the first NEP and the basis of it-the Kothari Commission. Kothari Commission report was a comprehensive and visionary one or education in our country. However many recommendations did not get implemented even after a lapse of fifty years and more.

    The concept of NEP 2020 is born from the UN Incheon declaration (The World Education Forum-May 2015) and (UNESCO) Education by 2030 Framework for Action (Nov 2015).

    If you compare the following with the salient features in NEP 2020 you can see the fact.
    Incheon Declaration and SDG4 – Education 2030 Framework for Action (pot no.6 under Vision, rationale and principles) includes "....By 2030, education systems will need to enrol hundreds of millions of additional children and adolescents to achieve basic education (that is, pre-primary, primary and lower secondary education) for all as well as provide equal access to upper secondary and post-secondary education opportunities for all. At the same time, it is critical to provide early childhood care and education to ensure children's long-term development, learning and health. It is also vital for education systems to ensure that all children, youth and adults are learning and acquire relevant skills, including proficiency in literacy"
    At another place (point 105) it says:" The Addis Ababa Action Agenda encourages countries to set nationally appropriate spending targets for education. National contexts are diverse, but the following international and regional benchmarks are crucial reference points: allocating at least 4% to 6% of gross domestic product (GDP) to education; and/or allocating at least 15% to 20% of public expenditure to education".

    These are just two quotes from the Incheon declaration material. If one compares the NEP2020 and this document we can see many word by word and line by line similarities. So let it be admitted first that the high decibel propaganda of having achieved something unique is just nothing but taking undeserving credit.

    So NEP 2020 is a clever mix of the unimplemented recommendation from Kothari Commission report and first NEP combined and brought under the UN framework of Education by 2030.

  • #706368
    The new education policy heavily stresses on learning soft skills and IT skills from a tender age. These sit right with the idea of industries India is approaching right now. We are one of the biggest software platforms in the world.
    Indians are often seen as introverts in the world picture. I've got some foreign friends and they often comment Indians are introverts. I myself was an introvert and a number of colleagues and classmates I know were too. Soft skills employ methods which would target an introvert and bring out his inner thoughts. There is nothing wrong in being an introvert. But it does affect one's professional life to a great degree. So for personal development of students this system of education is key.

    I was in college when we went for CRT( Campus recruitment Training). The skills listed in new education policy, are similar to what we did in CRT. When I came out of these soft skill coaching classes, I came out an extrovert. Having such skills integrated in school level itself will greatly reduce the introvert-like behavior that I've so often observed in my contemporaries.

    The stronger a light shines the darker are the shadows around it.

  • #706372
    Srinivasa Rao #706197 says about the practical deficiencies with the current Engineering graduates and hence supports the Vocational education in schools.
    In states like Kerala there is a functional system of Vocational education already. The Kerala government Web Portal says" Vocational Education is designed to prepare skilled work force in middle level in one or more group of occupations, trade or job after matriculation at 10+2 stage of Education. The objective of the course is to enhance individual employability and to provide an alternative for those pursuing higher education without particular interest or purpose. It is a distinct stream intended to prepare students for identified occupations. Directorate of Vocational Higher Secondary Education constituted during 1983-84. "

    Then we have ITIs(Industrial Trainig Institutes) imart various job skills and diploma holders are known to have more practical job knowledge.

    When we are eliminating child labour and lessening burden of students, is it not ironical to support internship for a sixth class student? Kerala has a good functioning system of vocational education. The Kerala system can be implemented in other places where it is not implemented.
    Even the Secondary Education Commission (Mudaliar Commission1952-53) had said "secondary education is a complete unit by itself... and at the end of the stage the student must be in a position to enter on responsibilities in life and take up some useful vocation. " We are still going back to square one in NEP 2020.What a pity!?

    (Of course that is again prescribed in the UN Education by2020 frame work: "If we can bring TVET earlier in school systems, build more TVET schools and help people to gain more technical education – and provide these learning opportunities through technology – we may be able to close the skills gaps and help people to be ready for jobs.")

  • #706375
    If we are happy with ITIs and diplomas why we should have so many engineering colleges and why so many people should go for studying degree courses. There should be some reason for it. So degree courses are also necessary. But they should not restrict themselves to the bookish knowledge. If they study both theory and practical operations also, then they can become a perfect technical manager who can design equipment, manufacture and operate the same equipment. That means an engineer will have complete knowledge about the total issue. In the present scenario that is not there. But with this vocational training and internship will give them on the job training and they can be full-fledged engineers.
    Earlier many States including AP talked about these vocational courses but to what extent? I have never seen those issues implemented. Any system success will depend on the implementation part. So if NET 2020 is implemented we will have more people with skills and ready to take up jobs.

    drrao
    always confident

  • #706376
    I don't have too many points to say, but only a very few points to highlight.
    1. Learning mother tongue from class I to class V will not help the students to learn better English which is an essential requirement in this world where English is supreme. Rightly brought out by Nadeem Naqvi. English being a foreign language should be learned from tender age.
    2. Vocational training from class 6 will not encourage students to study beyond, and may not be interested to get a degree.
    3. Many will stop their education beyond 5+3+3 and look for a job. The number of job seekers would be more while there are fewer job opportunities.
    4. There will be an enormous number of technicians trained as skilled laborers. To strike a nail, there would be many with hammers. There would be joblessness due to early vocational training at the primary level.
    5. Degree courses with a basic degree after one year in college, diploma degree after two years in college won't help the students in getting a job.
    Much more to discuss as it progresses.

    No life without Sun

  • #706377
    After my comment in #706244, I find many members have come up against my viewpoint. First of all, let me point out to all of you that I am not against skill-based learning. I am against the fact that making policy is not all. Present some clear cut employment opportunities that the students get interested in having vocational training too. In big cities like Delhi, a student who gets 90% in 12ih board exams are finding it difficult to get admission in a standard college. It is ridiculous. Where will the students of below 90% marks get enrolled? Why are policymakers not regulating this particular system? Isn't it good to prepare the future job prospects first and then lure the students with all such probabilities in the education system?

    Some members have highlighted the point that if the students learn some vocational skills, then one can start their own business. Is it that easy? Can everyone afford to start one? Taking a loan is again a burden on an unemployed.

    #706279
    Learn to drive in the school from class 6th is right in your opinion. What is the use? Where will he/she practise driving because a minor is not supposed to drive on the road, isn't it so? By the time a person is eighteen years of age, he/she would have forgotten the driving skill.

    shampasaid

  • #706381
    # 706377.
    I just gave an example. Not that only driving learning at 6th class. The people who designed this NET are very educated and professional and they will never ask the 6th class boy to drive a car. But a step in that direction may be started.
    If you see the education system in many other well-developed countries, they also give much importance to skill development rather than just degrees. A person with a degree and some skill will have a good scope.
    One has to face difficulties to come up. These days how many people are going for loans. So when the chances for you are more to generate wealth you should not think taking a loan is a burden.

    drrao
    always confident

  • #706382
    In continuation of my initial response in support of NEP 2020, I put forth the following viewpoints:
    1. The long-awaited and much needed NEP would balance opportunities of learning between the Rural and the urban students. I strongly emphasize this point because the brilliant and deserving students from rural and semi-urban areas are lagging behind those who belong to the urban population and that of metros just because of their area of the vicinity and the abundant educational opportunities. Yes, I stand by what I said. I have closely watched this disparity as a student and as a parent and well acquainted with the present Educational system being a teacher's son and relative and friend of many teachers.

    It is just because of the different syllabi adapted by the various State boards, CBSE and ICSE. Students who get the opportunity of studying in schools following the CBSE/ICSE pattern get a big edge over others and a maximum number of students representing the rural part, unfortunately, get the lesser opportunity. This area would be addressed well in the new NEP 2020.

    2. Introducing vocational education at the secondary level itself is a major step to guide the students to be self-reliant and also to opt for job-oriented studies. Also, awarding various Diploma,/graduation degrees at higher degree level is also quite a welcome recommendation as some people may opt-out of studies due to various reasons and rating their study based on the period they spend for studies with a Certificate, Diploma and a Degree is a good idea.

    #706365 @ Venkateswaran sir,
    As you said the Khotari commission has already made such recommendations and there is nothing new in this NEP 2020, your view may be partly true. But none of the succeeding Governments have taken initiatives to bell the cat and years have passed. Had some of the recommendations been implemented, there could have been more change we would have witnessed. But we all have to accept the very reason for setting aside such recommendations totally due to various reasons such as regional language problems, the North-South-East-West directional problems and whatnot. That's why I said it is all because of a lack of political will. In this democratic country, every political decision is taken based on 'votes and seats' and we can say the scenario has changed in the political thinking and dimension after General Elections 2014.

    Regards,
    Jagdish

  • #706385
    Mr. Rao,
    It is not only driving. It is taking a tool in hand. A sixth class student would be of 11 years of age. Is it the right age to take the tool in hand and learn the skill? There are many ITI and polytechnic students who are jobless after completing their studies. As rightly said by Shampa, it is not easy for everybody to start with a workshop or a business easily without cash. Moreover, we need to have teachers trained in such vocational training. Our government should have studied more before bringing out the NEP.

    Also, Kendriya Vidyala (Central School) spread around India will have difficulty in deciding the mother tongue/local/regional language. A central school will have students from all states of India. Then what would be the medium of instruction in KVs.

    No life without Sun

  • #706386
    It is a well-konwn fact that there are many government schools, especially in the villages there are very few teachers. Very few village students succeed in life, but why? The schools are not well maintained. The way schools in towns and cities are running, is it the same case with the government schools in interior India? What will be the use of such skill-based education policy if the kids of the villages do not get proper training as they require it the most? Let the Education Ministry emphasis on the appointment of regular teachers in village schools and their presence in the school. Conducting regular classes in such schools should be of vital importance, and then only ane can add vocational training. Let the students of interior India benefit from the education system too and for that schools in the villages must properly run first. It should be the priority of any ministry. Having a school is not everything, but properly running a school is of prime importance. Having every facility on paper will not benefit the future generation.

    #706381
    Let us opine by keeping in mind the villages of India. It is easy for a well to do family to take a loan for any purpose and not considering it as a burden. Kindly think about the needy villagers. A credit of a sum of money is always a pressure on the person. No one can ignore it.

    shampasaid

  • #706395
    #3.
    Venkiteswaranji(#706365), you have mentioned that the NEP 2020 is a mixture of the unimplemented recommendation from Kothari Commission report and first NEP combined and brought under the UN framework of Education by 2030 and I would support your claim as we know that any unimplemented policies can be amended and put forward like many other schemes that the new government try. Atleast we can be sure that the policy is brought in front of the daylight and will be implemented keeping the new UN education framework which is good for all.

    Venkiteswaranji(#706372), you have also commented that Kerala has a good functioning system of vocational education. The Kerala system can be implemented in other places where it is not implemented. We all know that Kerala has a good education background and it is helping the state to reach the height in every aspect as it has high literacy rate and good technical people. The vocational and on-hand training will help students to understand things more clearly and know what and how to go about than just theory which are bouncers for many. Much foreign education focuses on practical work as it enhances the skill of the children and helps them in better understanding and clear their concept.

    Nadeem Naqvi(#706345), you have mentioned that "The NEP2020 seems to prove that there has nothing like skilled learning before this announcement." I would say that we had vocational training courses but not given much importance as many were not clear of it but now, this will be made common and practical and skilled training will help children to have a better understanding of the concept as you mentioned about the 3 idiots movies. The last scene showed that many children in the interior were practically working on projects with the concept that is taught theoretically and could use it when required. You can imagine the scene when children use the electricity to punish the one pissing on the campus.

    SuN(#706385), you have mentioned that There are many ITI and polytechnic students who are jobless after completing their studies and A central school will have students from all states of India. Then what would be the medium of instruction in such school?
    -This is a valid point but we understand that when such policy is brought into effect, even the teachers will have the training to update their vocational skills so that that can impart it to their students. Now about many ITI and polytechnic students who are jobless, when you know how to join wires, repair a TV, motor, join pipes, give new connection, do the wiring, etc, you can work as an independent worker and attend to the needs of the people. The rates of a plumber, electrician, mechanic, mason, etc are quite high which can be very handy for skilled people.
    - Talking about the medium of instruction in central school, it can be fixed as Hindi as these will be working on the central syllabus and focusing on government people who transfer from one state to another and keep the mother tongue as the secondary language.

    “The most important thing in life is to learn how to give out love, and to let it come in." — Morrie Schwartz

  • #706397
    # 706385 @ Sun:

    I disagree with your view. Imparting skill based education from secondary level doesn't mean that making them qualified to become workshop owners or small Entrepreneurs. It is a beginning for them to learn the basics of skill development in the area of their interest.

    In the present structure of pattern, people are prepared to send their wards to techno-schools which impart education with an orientation to promote them to crack IIT-JEE/NEET/Civil services incurring much of the expenditure at an early stage. Does it mean that joining in such schools would ensure berth in IIT/NEET/Civils? It is just to impart training for them to learn the basics and same is the case here.

    Also, vocational course has a wide range of application such as tailoring, typing, carpentry etc., and they start imparting the basics at an early stage. I think Venkateswaran sir in his response has mentioned that ITIs are there to take care of such technical Education but what I understand from the NEP that all these ITI/Ploytechnic Institutes would be reoriented after the implementation of the policy. Let the system start working and the anomalies can be get checked.

    With regard to your observations about subjects taught in KVs and other schools, the main aim of the NEP 2020 is to bring all schools at state level and KVs & other central sponsored Institutes in the same wavelength and will have a common core syllabus and theme of imparting education which would take place gradually. We have waited for 34 year to have a policy and can't we wait few more months for their effective implementation and necessary correction?

    # 786386 @ Shampa Sadhya

    Your contention the villages and other interior parts in India have not good infrastructure and should be improved is quite right. But it is a concurrent subject and the State governments are responsible for providing better facilities and infrastructure. central government has nothing to do with this. If you observe, the central sponsored schemes and schools are working well. The Jawhar Navodaya Vidyalayas are the central sponsored schools and doing better job in rural parts. The infrastructure and education provided is far better than the State run schools. But these are not sufficient for rural educational development. As I said in my earlier response the present Educational system has created a big barrier between the rich and the poor and the Ruraland the urban. I am sure the new NEP 2020 will bring down the disparity.

    Regards,
    Jagdish

  • #706399
    I want to clarify about points raised in post #706376 and #706340.

    1. Learning the mother tongue and learning in the mother tongue both are very important and will be very helpful from Class I to V because children can easily understand in their mother tongue or regional language. English has not been removed it will be there but a child will not fall behind only because of English. The aim of NEP 2020 is to provide a multilingual platform to children and not to impose a language on anyone. "Three language formula" will be there. In many countries like Japan, China, Russia education medium is their own language and they never face any problem due to language at any stage.

    2 & 3. Vocational training and internship from class 6 will encourage the students as they will have many options to choose their field and they will get training and further according to their interest they can gain higher studies in their field of interest. Nowadays many consultants are there like energy consultants, environmental consultants, plumbing consultants, landscape consultant, and electrical consultants. And even doctors and lawyers are also consultants. That means to say is if students find his interest after getting some vocational training he can have an option to make further his career in that field and take higher studies. Yes, he can leave after 5+3+3 but if he wants higher education then definitely he will go to 5+3+3+4. After getting higher education job chances will also be higher. However, because of their skills, there will not even be a need for huge jobs they will be able to start their work. At a given time not all students can choose to stop education some will start their own business, and some will go for higher studies. But the difference will be that they will have some training experience in their hand and they will be more confident and self-dependent.

    4. Yes, there is still an enormous number of technicians as skilled labourers but they are not having proper training, illiterate and dependent on contractors. The early vocational training will help them to decide their career in the long run. They will be more skilled and with hands-on experience and can start their own business or even can get a job easily. Not all business requires much investment so it will not be difficult to start a small business. However, the NEP 2020 has an emphasis on making 'job creators' instead of 'job seekers'.

    5. Degree courses with a basic degree after one year in college, diploma degree after two years in college will help as his education will not get wasted and he will achieve certificate and diploma and credits which will be transferred when he will get admission in another college or university or course. Based on the certificate or diploma, he can take weightage and apply for a job.

  • #706406
    @#706197:"If we are happy with ITIs and diplomas why we should have so many engineering colleges and why so many people should go for studying degree courses. There should be some reason for it." The reason is unemployment, salary, career enhancement options etc. The proliferation of self financing colleges and mushrooming of 'Colleges of Technology 'sanctioned by political and other extra consideration created such a situation. It is the same Engineers and scientists who came out from our 10+2+3/4 system who were responsible for the till now development of our country. All the roads and bridges and buildings and appliances still work and sturdy and durable.
    A student of sixth class cannot take a decision as to what sector or organisation he will be employed or what business he will don after becoming adult. The fifteen year gap can change anything. Things change overnight. So what is the utility of an internship at such a lower age? Is it not against the principles of child labour? At such an age parent only will be the decider and the student may need to change it later . So ill it note result in total wastage of time and other resources? We had a system of Junior Technical schools where High school class students were allowed to opt to learn job oriented essential skills like carpentry, smithy, welding, fabricating, electrical jobs etc. It is prudent to bring the same back. When I was in high school, our school allowed a choice to select Typewriting /Book keeping in high school as one subject instead of part II in one language.
    @706203 mentioned "revision is coming after 34 years, the policy looks good and in lines with the foreign country education policy that will help our students to have a concentration on the core subject of their interest than having to study every subject.". This is where patently we go wrong. Why should we have foreign solutions for our problems? We have our own unique problems for which we need to have our own specific problems. We still blame Macaulay for our education and still feel happy to import new systems from abroad. Strange!
    @#706243: " Now 5+3+3+4 system will be in place of10+2 system. " . What is the real change here" The new NEP just formalises what is already in existence. There was already 10+2=12. TThre was a play school, LKG and UKG too practically. Now it is given formal recognition. That is all. The SSA-Samagra Shiksha Abhyan also specifies thes things only. So it is just an overlap. NEP has either to override SSA or render it as superfluous.
    SSA also says what NEP says:
    Holistic approach to education
    • Single Scheme for the School Education Sector from Classes I to XII- extension of interventions to senior secondary stage.
    • Treat school education holistically as a continuum from Pre-school to Class 12
    • Supporting States to initiate pre-primary education
    • Inclusion of senior secondary levels and pre-school levels in support for School education for the first time
    It also says :
    "Vocational Education to be introduced as an integral part of general education at Secondary and Senior Secondary level as per guidelines of vocational education scheme. The vocational subjects are to be introduced as an additional subject at the secondary level and as compulsory (elective) at the Senior Secondary level."
    So what is there new and 'revolutionary' in NEP 2020?

  • #706409
    #706386

    In this post, it s mentioned that students of the interior will not be benefitted from the new education system, but I think students from the rural areas will be more benefitted with the policy as this will give the opportunity to gain the practical experience and start their own work. Even now students from rural areas join ITI and other short term courses and after the implementation of NEP 2020 this will be proved as a boon for them.

  • #706410
    @#706268: It is a generally accepted fact that little children should be taught in mother tongue in the early years. But it is also an accepted and researched fact that little children easily learn multiple languages and know when and where to use. To make it compulsory across the country without any exception will be a great practical hurdle. That will be a real problem for those children whose parents are liable for frequent Al-India transferable jobs. For example in a staff quarters of a central government/public sector colony one can see children with different mother tongues. But they all play and comfortably interact in one or more common language. For such children, the mother tongue may be one, the medium of study will be another and the language for common interaction may be another. Hence there should be one common language taught all over the country in spite of medium of instruction to serve as lingua franca.
    #706271:" The New Education policy 2020 has been introduced with the aim to make India self-reliant. ". A good dream indeed. A thorough reading can reveal that a huge amount is to be spent on education. say 6% of GDP. It will naturally lead to FDI and foreign education business entering in education sector in large way. We now know the havoc and harm caused by FDI and open market in Media sector and trade. What havoc it may cause in education sector is just anybody's guess. There will be only 'International schools' everywhere around us. That will simply take education out f affordable bounds.
    #706279: 'multiple exit options and appropriate certification.' This is going to be a remedy worse than disease. It will work well only if there are suitable job opportunities for each stage completion. Otherwise t will lead to students simply lazying and dropping out with the guarantee of a certificate. Now at least a good percentage put seriousness in study in the fear of losing out or losing the fees remitted etc. Though theoretically it looks ideal, practically 'out of touch' will have a discontinuity effect and only a very very minor fraction will revive and re-enter. At the same time this will affect the sanctioned strength of the institution. The re-entry may be like the lateral entry now available in certain courses. However practically there will be problems of syllabus updation etc. There will be issues which we now face in certain universities of students overstaying just adornig the status of students.

  • #706411
    #706280: Sanskrit language: I would like to point out that in the draft policy Hindi was mentioned and it was made a big issue by certain state especially TN a Hindi thrusting. So in the Policy document they avoided it. Now Sanskrit may also receive similar treatment.. Education being a concurrent subject, there will be more and more local bias in more and more points. The implementation will not be smooth at all. In NEP2020, actually the three-language formula is more watered down than previously.

    #706309: flexibility options: This will be more confusing by and by. There will not be any end to combinations and option. There is already such system in some states. But thouh theoretically it looks free and ideal, practically there has to be certain fixed choices and combinations only. Moreover this will be needing updation frequently. There will not be much takers for certain subjects like Maths, pure science etc which is the scene even now. That will affect the research back up of the country. As there will not be strict control and most institutions will be autonomous there will be many 'irrational combination' courses which wil be counterpoducive.

    #706311: "scenarios which we had 34 years back are not the same now.". I don't know what gives you such a solid confidence that the NEP20 will make changes now? The policy or rules whether it was in 1952, 66,70, 86 or 92 were all good and well intended. Bu the implementation was the problem. Even the NEP20 writers themselves say it will take at least 15 to 20 years.
    Will the world be same as today then? It was just within one decade that the whole world changed into digital. It is just within three month of Covid that the education system went online in toto in India . So if necessitated things can change overnight also. Otherwise all these may remain just in paper.

    #706314: vocational education. This is still available. If it is to be given thrust why not expand that stream? There is already infrastructure and experience. The VHSE institutions are running successfully and the students coming out get employment also.

    #706333: I appreciate this admission of a glut when everybody rushes to some lucrative subjects or courses. This is what I said earlier. Unless and until there is a proper match of demand and supply the unemployment or underemployment will happen in one or other.

  • #706412
    Let me tell all those who are so vocal about skill education and supporting the courses of becoming a carpenter, mason, electrician and so on that it's not a worthy scheme. Would you promote your child to become an electrician or anyone of the above mentioned above? Surely not, skill-based education and internship should come after 10th and not from 6th standard. The secondary educational background should not lure for any income, and it will make the students make a worthy choice for their life or else the downtrodden will use minor children as their means to earn money. The poor will take advantage of such vocational course and make their kids earn money for the family. Educationally there will be a big gap between people of rich and poor.

    Well, it seems we all have got mesmerised by the skill-based education and not keen to discuss other points. I read in a report on the NEP 2020 that an engineering student can opt for Music with Physics. Is it the right recommendation? If students choose Music in place of Mathematics, then how can the student become a reliable engineer? Can a student of Physics do away with Mathematics? It's a baseless suggestion.

    shampasaid

  • #706413
    #706409
    You have just picked one part of my comment and comfortably presented it with your argument. I have mentioned in my point that the rural students need to benefit the most from skill-based education in school, but it won't happen in reality. I explained that in rural India, most of the schools do not have the required number of teachers. Classes should be regular, and even attendance of the students is not proper. How will the skill education benefit rural students? First, the school should function well, students must be encouraged to come to school, and then only vocational courses will prove to be helpful.

    shampasaid

  • #706414
    I completely agree with the positive effects of the new education policy and would like to elaborate on the points which I appreciate about this policy. It gives students a lot of flexibility to choose a career as per their interest and escape the trap of rote learning of our current education system, which was a need of the hour.
    Firstly the removal of the clear distinction of various streams which and giving a kind of equal platform for all the streams and same respect for all the streams in student's mind. And no marks criteria after board exams for selecting a stream is a sigh of relief for a student and also provides him with more options in life.
    As many students take science courses under family and social pressures but later on in their life they opt for humanities courses as they find these subjects more interesting. It will save several years and time for these students. Engineering graduates are the biggest example of such students who you might find in every other profession.
    Secondly the entry and exit windows for the students which again provide a student with an opportunity to continue his or her education at any point of time if he has to leave it for some reason in the past. And he or she will never be completely disappointed if have to left the course in the midway as they will get some sort of certificates and diploma at each level.
    Thirdly at school level providing facilities of learning vocational courses and coding is the nicest thing that government has done since it is the skill which Indian students lack not the theoretical knowledge of things.
    We have millions of students with various degrees in their hands with no or little practical knowledge of real-life implementation of things.
    Creating an environment from the school level will be a good thing.

    "It is hardest thing in the world to be good thinker without being a good self examiner"

  • #706431
    Mohan #706333
    More number of skilled workers will lead to competition between them. But if we look at a wider angle, the economy is benefiting from it. These days the daily wages paid paid to skilled workers are high, because of which people tend to learn things on their own by watching You Tube or postponing their need. Eg: As the stitching charges have increased day by day, there are some who started learning tailoring not be a professional but at least to stitch their own clothes so as to save money. But as the number of skilled workers increases, the wage scale also will decrease and even the poor and the middle class people will be able to afford a skilled worker. However, skilled workers will fetch job as the demand for these workers are comparatively more.

    I have read come comments from my opponents saying that if the medium of instruction is local language then students will not learn English. I object this as the subject English will always be part of the curriculum. Secondly, I have seen in villages that many children are sent to the government schools which still has the local language as the medium of instruction or even if it is known as English medium, the language used will be the local language. Parents sent their kids to these schools because the of the high fees demanded by the private and management based English medium schools. Are we saying our students who passed out of these government schools are all unemployed? Don't they know how to read and write English or to speak?

    In ISC itself there will be some members who might have studied in the schools which adopted local language as the medium of communication. But are we able to differentiate them, No, because English is taught everywhere and as the necessity arises, everyone will learn the language.

    Sun #706385
    In Kendriya Vidyalayas the medium of instruction should be made as Hindi. Hindi is a widely used language in India still there are many who does not know to communicate in this language. As a citizen of India, I think each one of us should know Hindi. I have seen people who change the TV channel when any important decision about the country and its citizens are announced by the PM of the country. Because the language used is Hindi and in South India not everyone can understand the language. Instead, they select the local channel or depends upon the English subtitles to understand what has been said/declared. I think this has to be changed as information can go wrong when it is translated. Being a part of a country where majority speaks Hindi, it is better each and everyone of us can understand the language.

    Shampa Sadhya #706412
    Regarding skill based learning from an early stage, it does not mean at Grade 6th itself students will be taught the skills in full. We start to learn English from KG does not mean we master it at a very small age. We begin with alphabets only, similarly when skill based education is introduced, the students will be taught with the basics first.

    I repeat, learning a skill is not only to get a job. May be we might not want our kids to be an electrician (just an example) but definitely learning the skill is good and I promote that because he will at least know how to do the basic electrical works at home. For that at least he does not have to depend upon any one. As he grows he can choose the course he want to study and get into a white collar job but the skill he learned will be useful for him at least once in his lifetime. Hence there is nothing wrong in learning a skill and in fact it is a good move.

    Regards
    Chitra
    "Do not give up, things might not favour you always"

  • #706432
    Chitra,
    Let me take one issue.
    You say that learning a skill is not only to get a job but to do that job for us keeping away the skilled labourer. By doing this, we are reducing the employment opportunities of a person who earns his bread through his skills. So I disagree with your statement. Vocational training is created for utilizing the skill for earning only. If he grows to choose a white-collar job after wasting his time for learning the skill, is it not a wastage of time and energy? Therefore, I would say that vocational training would increase unemployment.

    Let a person develop this skill on their own outside the school, and not waste years and the government money for learning it from school and not utilizing it to benefit as a profession.

    No life without Sun

  • #706436
    #706412 Shampa Sadhya
    Regarding the subjects one can choose,
    (1) A student is not only allowed to select two subjects, hence he shouldn't restrict him to only Music and Physics. If his aim is to be an Engineer, definitely he can choose Mathematics as well. But what if he wants to be a musician and was interested in knowing about Physics? In that case there is no harm in choosing Physics with Music. I studied Commerce, but in schools Biology was my favorite subject and used to score full marks for it. I wanted to learn Biology in future as well, not because I can afford to be a doctor but just because I was interested in the subject. I love commerce but along with i if I had the opportunity to choose Biology, I would have done that.

    (2) I quote "If students choose Music in place of Mathematics, then how can the student become a reliable engineer?" Why not? Our ancient monuments where built so nicely, I think even the architects and engineers of these days can't even construct such beautiful structures. I do not think the people behind these constructions had master degree in engineering. Similarly, even today in villages you get to see the carpenters who haven't even gone to school, making and carving beautiful furniture. Maths is a must for this as well, but they have never learned it in school still they shine because their interest lies in it or they have inherited the knowledge through their family.

    #706411 Venkiteswaran
    How can you say that it is the same as 34 years back. Like you said recently due to covid we have seen many changes. We have moved to digital education, yes it is the need of today.
    Eg: 34 years back many skilled labors were available, now it is hard to find skilled labors. The wages paid for these workers also have changed over a period of time.
    Secondly, the number of people working abroad or migrating was less 34 years back but now that is not the case.
    Thirdly, earlier more people where send to schools which used local language as the medium of instruction, but now majority of the kids are enrolled in English medium schools.
    Like you said I agree that implementation of NEP is not very easy. But if we stick on to the old policy, after 20 years it will be a 44 years old policy and nothing will be the same then, hence a change is inevitable.

    #706432 Sun
    By doing a particular work on our own, if we are reducing the employment opportunities, then most of us are doing that. By cooking ourselves at home, we are hindering the employment opportunities for servants or cooks. I think it is better if one can manage to do his things on his own rather than spending the hard earned money. Similarly what if I have no income, how do I hire a skilled labor? Instead if I know the particular skill I can manage on my own.

    Secondly, skills are introduced from Grade 6th on wards. The NEP is not saying from 6th on wards a student will study only the skill he wants to learn and will not learn any other subjects. Along with other subjects a skill is also been taught. Which means additional knowledge is been imparted. In short, at the end of his educational life, he will learn at least one skill. Then it is up to the student to decide whether to choose a skill based career or a white collar job. Even if he opt to go for an office job, the skill he learned will be useful. Just because he learned a skill, he is not loosing anything. In fact he is benefiting. This is why I said, need not necessary that he earns income through the skill, he can at least save his money because he knows a particular skill.

    Regards
    Chitra
    "Do not give up, things might not favour you always"

  • #706437
    Chitra,
    Our government wants skilled labourers to have the "Make in India" programme successful. Vocational training helps to achieve it. It should help to open up many manufacturing units. If after learning the skills, if they go for a white collar job, is it not the wastage of time and energy and government money?

    No life without Sun

  • #706438
    I would like to add one more point that the NEP will decrease the stress of the students. We know that today's policy increases the stress of the students. Many students commit suicide due to this stress. The NEP will certainly help in reducing the burden and stress of the students. Hence it will help in solving social problems.

    The new education policy will also strength online learning which is the backbone of the future. We have observed that online classes have been started in every part of India including small villages.

    The teachers will be trained and it would really a great point of the NEP. The teacher's training is provided presently through a traditional way but after NEP the teachers would get training and after that, they have to pass an examination. It would really help in making good teachers.

    Honesty is the best policy.

  • #706439
    It is well known and felt by most of us that the present education system has many deficiencies and shortcomings and now the Govt wants to bring a unified education policy for the country in which emphasis is given for the local languages as well as opportunities to the students of the remote places to participate in national level competitions etc. This new scheme is also promising for skill based and innovative education, the need for which is being felt in every sphere of our lives. There are many agencies which are managing the education in our country at different levels in private as well as Govt level from state to state. So there needs to be present some central agency and guidelines under which everything comes under a scanner and things are streamlined as per the new aspirations. I fully agree that the new policy proposed by Govt would be able to remove many of the shortcomings and bottlenecks in the present system. It is also correct that we cannot change the system in one go as the modification and development is a continuous process and a good start would help in taking the present educational system to a better proposition and status in the coming times.
    Thoughts exchanged is knowledge gained.

  • #706444
    Ms Chitra (#706311) you mean to say that the education system and all the courses and everything would change in the span of 34 years? Nothing will change it is just a perception that has to be seen with wider and broader perspective. Children are not guinea pigs where in experiment are to be conducted. There are old ages proven systems of education that have to be enhanced and used but religiously. The problem is not with the education system the problem is in its implementation.

    Dr Rao (#706353) and Mr. Varghese (#706395) As per your argument regarding the vocational training.
    My argument to both of you, for your information and for the information of the other members here I would like to add that ITIs have over 130 different specialities being taught at their centres across the nation. There are more than 20,000 ITIs across the country. One can get admission to ITI after completion of class 8th or 10th from regular schooling. There are different courses for class 8th passed out and for class 10th passed out. But here in the NEP2020, it is said that students will be given vocational training in carpentry, electric work, metalwork, gardening, pottery making etc., from 6-8 grades this is what I oppose.
    To add more the Ministry of Skill Development has been opening Skilled Training Centres across the nation since 2014 they further add to the vocational learning then why to endanger the tender brains of all the students?

    Sun (#706376) Thanks for agreeing to me!

    It is shocking that none of the members has raised the issue of welcoming of Foreign Universities to India which was raised by me (#706340) point number 7.

    One more point to argue here, as per the NEP2020 I am quoting the actual text from the NEP2020 document to make all understand what actually the government is trying to say (editors would understand as to why I have to use the actual text and would allow me to do so) QUOTE: 1.1. Over 85% of a child's cumulative brain development occurs prior to the age of 6, indicating the critical importance of appropriate care and stimulation of the brain in the early years in order to ensure healthy brain development and growth. Presently, quality ECCE is not available to crores of young children, particularly children from socio-economically disadvantaged backgrounds. Strong investment in ECCE has the potential to give all young children such access, enabling them to participate and flourish in the educational system throughout their lives. Universal provisioning of quality early childhood development, care, and education must thus be achieved as soon as possible, and no later than 2030, to ensure that all students entering Grade 1 are school ready.UNQUOTE This whole point seems to be just full of HOPE which can never fulfil as per the last sentence of this quote here. On the other hand, they are trying to say that I was not having any education system until the announcement of NEP2020. It is just playing with words and proving us what we already had, still bragging that there is something new.

    Regards,
    Nadeem Naqvi


    World without God is Zero without One!

  • #706445
    Dr Deepali (#706399) I would like you to go through the draft of the NEP2020 again and then we would discuss. You have an argument about the three-language system, which is prevalent in other countries, consider the facilities also. Do we have those facilities here? The introduction of Sanskrit will make it 4 language system, where are the options for? Language learning has been there in schools in the way back in the 70s is it new now, I don't think so. I have my apprehension only about one language that is English to be taught at an early age so that the students are competitive across the globe.

    Mr Jagdish (#706397) why there is a need for reorientation of things when the same is working on a proven method. I have earlier mentioned that the students are not guinea pigs to be experiment upon. Vocation training is opted by the students who are not able to cope with the studies and the parents think that they can get some training and could earn their living at the latter stage of life.

    Mr Venkiteswaran (#706406) the concept of ITIs is to provide you basic training and to educate the student to the level wherein he can earn his livelihood. IIT and other Engineering colleges are for further learning and enhancing your knowledge. It is like that if we have better universities then what the need of the schooling system is!

    Mr Venkiteswaran (#706411) Agreed to your point with respect to the Sanskrit language. This force will eventually give birth to hatred for language.

    Ms Sampa Sadhya (#706412) Vocational training at the tender age is opposed even by me. I have arguments about it in my past comments.

    I would add further that the education system has to be relooked again. The learning system is being done away with, that is the backbone of our education system since ages. Our elders never required calculators; they were proficient enough to do calculations verbally. Take care of your children at home and make them by heart the basis of maths and elementary languages so that they are not dependent on the gadgets.

    Regards,
    Nadeem Naqvi


    World without God is Zero without One!

  • #706446
    #4.
    Venkiteswaranji(#706406), You have pointed out that It is the same Engineers and scientists who came out from our 10+2+3/4 system who were responsible for the till now development of our country. All the roads and bridges and buildings and appliances still work and sturdy and durable.
    - I know many engineering students who could not complete their course and left after 2nd or 3rd year and their years are wasted but in the present policy, it mentions that the Undergraduate education can be for three-four years with multiple exit options and appropriate certifications i.e. after the completion of one year you get a certificate, an ITI after two years, an advanced diploma after three years and bachelor's degree/research after four years. So you get a certificate after completion of every year which can be used for a job without losing your years which is normally followed in many foreign countries.

    SuN(#706186), as you have mentioned that such a major policy decision should have been tabled in the parliament and discussed with all the highly educated opposition leaders who would have suggested more to add this NEP 2020. A unilateral decision will have a negative impact though it looks good now.
    - The Draft National Education Policy was constituted in June 2017 under the chairmanship of renowned scientist K. Kasturirangan that submitted the draft of new NEP on May 2019 to the Human Resource Development Minister which was presented on July 2020.

    SuN(#706437), You pointed out that If after learning the skills, if they go for a white-collar job, is it not the wastage of time and energy and government money?
    - Even now we have many engineers working in Banks and other government sectors, many science students working in the arts or commerce profession, many MBA working in HR, Finance, etc. The vocational training doesn't mean that they can't opt-out or change their profession. The main aim of the NEP is to make education flexible so that the students can learn what they like and have passion instead of just what is made compulsory.

    Shampa Sadhya(#706413)you have put forward that most of the schools do not have the required number of teachers. Classes should be regular, and even attendance of the students is not proper. How will the skill education benefit rural students? First, the school should function well, students must be encouraged to come to school, and then only vocational courses will prove to be helpful.
    - The NEP proposes a considerable change in the examination structure that will test primarily core capacities/competencies rather than months of coaching and memorisation. The examination will be made easier and test the capabilities and have Key stage assessments that would track would the development of the child at different Grades i.e. 3, 5 and 8 which will be good for students and will not be burdened of only mugging-up or memorising. This will encourage students to come to school and even other facilities are on the plan.
    A comprehensive National Curriculum Framework for Teacher Education will be formulated by the National Council for Teacher Education, in consultation with the NCERT. By 2030, the minimum qualification for teaching will be a four-year integrated B.Ed. degree.

    “The most important thing in life is to learn how to give out love, and to let it come in." — Morrie Schwartz

  • #706448
    I have joined the discussions a bit late but I have advantage of going through the various points put forward by the members. I fully agree that there was a need for the new educational policy to make reforms in this important sector. At the same time I have some apprehensions in my mind and I do not agree that it is going to make remarkable changes except which those that Govt is already doing year after year. It is sad to hear that but my experience with all our earlier reform plans is not very healthy and in our system planning is sometimes at different level and implementation is done at an entirely different level. There are so many types of educational institutions in our country having different fee structure and for a common person there is no single institute where one can get a cheaper and reasonable education. How that is going to be mitigated in the new policy is not understood. Moreover the bureaucratic systems and nepotism in educational sector is a well known thing and I need not to impress upon that. How this policy would be a showcase and benchmark in our future educational endeavours is also not understood as our systems are already grappled with inefficiency and unproductive works.
    Knowledge is power.

  • #706473
    @Chitra
    Every knowledge is beneficial, but that does not mean one must get training of being an electrician or carpenter and whatnot at the age of ten or eleven. A school can hold workshops for such activities. Let me explain to you one point that till secondary level school should pay more importance to the education of various subjects. From eleventh students can opt for any stream along with skill training of their choice. Everyone knows that while we start the education, we learn alphabets first, but we must remember that alphabet learning is neither risky nor hazardous. Let the education policy be such that does not push the small students from getting injured, and so on.

    Next is, you believe that skill training will at least come handy once in a lifetime. Isn't it a waste of time and money? Just for once, you want skill training to become mandatory. In the present age, the maximum number of households hire a cook, sweeper, even for dusting, and you expect the generation next will repair the defective pieces by themselves. Yes, such training will be beneficial for those who are not interested in higher studies or are not good at studies. It will help them to make a livelihood out of it, but then again, training should not start until they are little matured.

    shampasaid

  • #706478
    Varghese,
    You have said that many Engineering students are working in banks, many science students are working in the arts and commerce profession. Is it right? What is the use of wasting many years to become an engineer and work in banks as clerks? It is mainly due to unemployment for engineering and science students. In fact, the NEP should help to come out of such problems. Whereas, the NEP is also paving the way to remain in the same stage without any change. By introducing vocational training from class 6, we are not helping the students for their better future. It would be a time pass activity for the very young child students from class 6 to 8. Vocational training should be given for the purpose of self-employment and for the development of country.

    Chitra,
    In your #706436, You have said "By doing a particular work on our own, if we are reducing the employment opportunities, then most of us are doing that. By cooking ourselves at home, we are hindering the employment opportunities for servants or cooks."

    Tell me, how many ladies or gents performing the cooking job at home have undergone vocational training to be a cook at home? Cooking is natural art that many are blessed with, especially the housewives. Your comparison is not justified.

    No life without Sun

  • #706479
    Mr Varghese (#706446) Vocational Training for the tender kids is not a good idea no matter what argument you may have. I cannot give a saw or hammer my kid hand who is just about 10 years of age. I will love to see a paintbrush or a book in his hand.
    You have argued that many engineers even join banks; it is like students of various schemes compete for Civil Service which is more or less the final choice of students of Humanities.
    The government is not going to test the skills of the children through the vocational training and if at all they are going to do this then this should be done even at a younger age. Like in other countries they focus on to understand the aptitude of the child and then they plan for his/her education.
    Vocation training is already being done through ITIs wherein the students can learn and then earn with a certificate they are provided with. On the other hand, there have been cases wherein the certificate holder of ITI has even competed for further education, though this percentage is very negligible.

    Regards,
    Nadeem Naqvi


    World without God is Zero without One!

  • #706483
    The vocational course introduction means a 6th class student need not operate heavy machines or need not become an expert. But they will get oriented to that style of education which will give them some additional advantage. There are plenty of choices for the student to select the subjects he wanted. A 10 years kid need not handle a big hammer. But he can see a hammer and he can understand how it can be used. The students will be oriented more towards the application part of the theory what they have studied.
    Three language formula will be continued in the present system and there is no difference in the system. As such there will not be any problem in deciding on the medium of instruction,
    Multiple exit points are always advantageous to the student. He will never be left out without a qualification. People who are not able to continue their studies because of some personal problems will come out of education with some qualification in his hand.

    drrao
    always confident

  • #706484
    #706478
    Introduction of vocational trainings to the education system is for the skill development among the students. The idea is not to compel them to choose the same career. And the student will choose any one of his choice among the various skill trainings like craft, carpentry, etc. It will be like a workshop only. There will be 10 bag less days during which student will learn these skills. I don't think that there is any harm in any skill development. The aim of the new education policy is to ensure that every child comes out of school with at least one skill. That skill will be beneficial for their future. It is not necessary every skill development course will be converted to a job or career. Any skill can be used for your personal use. Like everybody learns car driving not of because he wants to be professional driver but he wants to drive his own car. Likewise there are several courses which are learned for personal use. But these vocation training might be very helpful in their professional career also.

    #706437

    I am happy that you have accepted that Vocational training helps to achieve the government aim of the "Make in India" programme. But who can say that after getting these skills one cannot do a white collar jobs? I already told in my post that nowadays there are several professions like electrical consultants, plumbing consultants, and landscape consultants. Children can enter in such type of professions if they found their interest in that field. Hand-on experience gained during early schooling will definitely help them to understand the concept. For example, while studying agriculture or agricultural entomology students from agricultural background get more advantage because they already have practical knowledge of crops, pests, pesticides. They easily understand the concepts and their applications.

  • #706486
    #706413
    Government is taking new initiatives and for the proper implementation, there will be a proper step. I am sure after implementation of the policy the students from rural and remote areas and their parents will be convinced with the vocational programmes because right now the education system has no such kinds of practices. Hence vocational training will the point of attraction which will definitely encourage the student to come and join the school on a regular basis. In NEP 2020 it has been clearly mentioned that "Every state/district will be encouraged to establish ''Bal Bhavans'' as a special daytime boarding school, to participate in art-related, career-related, and play-related activities. Free school infrastructure can be used as Samajik Chetna Kendras." So will be no question of infrastructure and facilities.

  • #706498
    Dr Rao, I don't understand your logic. You want skill-based education for a sixth class student to see the tools such as hammer and how it is used. I think for such a purpose, a home is the best place. Now and then something malfunctions and an eligible person is hired to fix it. The kids can learn from it also.

    #706486
    You are mentioning all such statements which the education ministry has presented on paper. Are we living in the fool's paradise? Every government states that the rural scenario will change, but the fact is a negligible change takes place. It sounds good that the policymakers have drafted all the steps that will take place in the interior part of India, but the reality is far from our expectation. Don't go by the proposals, first make sure that all the schemes get implemented rightly. By saying so, I do not support the skill training of the little kids. One accident can ruin their life. Immatured age is not fit to handle any tool.

    Well, I want to raise another point. The NEP 2020 says that some world-famous universities would establish an educational unit in India. Do the franchise prove to be as good as the age-old educational institutions? It's next to impossible. The government will earn a hefty amount from it, but students will not benefit much. A branch of Cambridge cannot be at par with the original one. Foreign universities will be too expensive. In India, private colleges and universities are too costly about which no government takes action. Capping the fee structure is the requirement of the day, but the authorities are just disinterested in it. Let the policy talk about minimizing educational cost but no step undertaken towards it. Their plan promotes more educational expenditure.

    shampasaid

  • #706500
    @706340 & 706345; A very fair analysis of NEP2020. I appreciate you for your take on point on foreign universities. Overall your view is that NEP2020 mentions only things which were already here.
    That is what I was mentioning in my posts. I repeat a portion from my post 706167:" My take on NEP 2020 is nothing but a dream peddled in verbose, old wine in new bottle and marketed in a very wrong time. It is just a verbal exercise aiming to impress the vast section of the confused youth and not-so-updated parents too." In 706365 I have said that "the high decibel propaganda of having achieved something unique is just nothing but taking undeserving credit."
    However as per the GD guidelines you have to be clearly on one side either to see the NEP20 as positive or negative. As per this post you seem to see the NEP as negative.

    #706397 Jagdish Patro says "present Educational system has created a big barrier between the rich and the poor and the Rural and the urban. I am sure the new NEP 2020 will bring down the disparity." It is a good hope. But practically the distance will only become wider. We have seen this in all field after entry of FDI. Once NEP2020 gets implemented it will be as per UN framework. The funding aspect is highlighted there. There is already a big lobby in our country biased towards anything foreign as bets. So very soon education sector will be taken over by foreign entities and investors. Foreign investors will be putting money only for profit. They will market in such a way that we will be colonised in another way via education sector. A literal brain wash-nay takeover. In the neo liberal open situation, there will not be any control and our policies will be dominated by and big business interests only. We have seen this in every sector.

  • #706502
    Now let me take salient clauses in NEP20 and analyse it:

    Part I. SCHOOL EDUCATION
    "This policy envisages that the extant 10+2 structure in school education will be modified with a new pedagogical and curricular restructuring of 5+3+3+4 covering ages 3-18..."
    This is already envisaged by Kothari Commission principal recommendations 1964-66

    And I quote:
    "School educational system-10+2+3 systems
    1 The new educational system should consist of
    a. 1 to 3 years of preschool education
    b. lower primary stage of 4 to 5 years
    c.higher primary stage of 3 or 2 years
    d.lower secondary stage of 3 or 2 years
    e.higher secondary stage of 2 years of vocational education
    2 age of admission to Class 1 ordinarily not to be less than 6
    3 First public examination to come at the end of 10 years of schooling."Unquote
    .............Any difference? If so find it.

    Let us see the NEP2020 proposal.about-ECCE.
    As of now it is a choice to send children to pre-primary education. Is NEP2020 going to make it mandatory?
    It just says "The overarching goal will be to ensure universal access to high-quality ECCE across the country in a phased manner."This will be done "through a significantly expanded and strengthened system of early-childhood education institutions consisting of (a) stand-alone Anganwadis; (b) Anganwadis co-located with primary schools; (c) pre-primary schools/sections covering at least age 5 to 6 years co-located with existing primary schools; and (d) stand-alone pre-schools".
    .
    It is here I have some concerns.
    The Anganwadi are functioning well and are the latter day avatar of the TN pioneered "Sathunavu Thittam' or mid-day meal programme. So the policy visions its expansion to all parts of the country available to all children. Hence it is not a revolutionary policy invention, but an extension in implementation of an already well functioning scheme. The policy need not claim credit for that.

    In Kerala even many government schools have the pre-primary education –LKG and UKG. There are many private branded and non-branded schools in the play school-pre-primary section. From now on, seeing the lucrative business, corporate enmities will be entering the sector with high litter brand name and marketing. Multinational franchisees will also enter and dominate. So the pre-school, pre-primary sector will be dominated by the high cost brands again adding to the disadvantage of the vulnerable sections. There will be even entrance exam for child and parents (which we all despise now) for admissions. Once the choice is removed and compulsion is implemented, practically children will not get home teaching and parental/grandparental care and native and traditional wisdom transferred from generations. Children are going to lose the umbilical connections and our country will also become like other countries where an affectionate kiss or sleeping with parents will be considered as aberration. Children will be moulded by set modules even in their food habits, language usage and ethnicity. We may get groomed live robots.

    I wish they would have left the existing system unchanged. It is working wonderfully in states like Kerala. The care taken in Kerala is so good that the government is reaching food grains and food ingredient kits to children's home even during vacation and the present Covid lockdown. So definitely for parents and students of at least Kerala and such similar state the NEP2020 is retrograde and negative only.

    The NEP carries a clause" It is envisaged that prior to the age of 5 every child will move to a "Preparatory Class" or "Balavatika" (that is, before Class 1)," It is not clear what it means ,whether it will be included in the Anganwadi etc or will be stand alone schools. Avoidable overlapping or avoidable segregation.

  • #706518
    @Chitra
    Learning Music with Physics is not a disqualification at all, rather an added talent. I must mention here that studying Physics without learning Mathematics side by side is invariably a demerit. Opting for Physics without Mathematics cannot make an engineer or physicist. Such student would block a seat while someone interested in taking up a career in the field of Physics will miss the bus. During higher studies, one aims for settlement in life and not just for fun or gain basic knowledge. There are numerous music institutions where any interested candidate can enrol and learn. Even they can give examination of vocal or instrument and get a valid degree. Those who are interested in the knowledge of Physics can go through various Physics books and magazines accordingly.

    The members who are supporting NEP2020 to them I want to ask a question. The entrance examinations are difficult to crack because the schools prepare the students only for the Board exams. Thus, the coaching institutions are having a gala time. The new policy wants to shut down the coaching institutions. It's a good thought but, shouldn't the teaching pattern in the eleventh and twelfth be at par with the entrance examinations? Take the example of Kota, where students get enrolled in various coaching institutions and leave their regular school. Most of them get good percentile in an entrance exam, but the students who prepare for the exams based on school teaching make a mark hardly. What is at fault: teaching method or exam pattern?

    Shutting down the coaching institutions would be a good move, but what will happen to those who are making a livelihood out of it? Resettling them must be looked after, or else unemployment, which is a big issue till now, will increase further.

    @Varghese
    I have addressed in my post #706498 the point you mentioned. Policies are good on paper, but how much it will be followed and worked upon is a matter of doubt. India has faced many such policies earlier in different sectors where written rules speak something else while functions very differently. A bribe is illegal in our country but, isn't it randomly practised? Let's wait and watch that policymakers do justice to their plans or not. It is unlikely, in my opinion.

    shampasaid

  • #706519
    I would like to continue with the important point of the new education policy that there is only one competition exam for admission in higher education. It would be beneficial to the students. They would be able to compete nation wise and the talented student will get admission for higher classes.

    The new education policy would open a new era in the field of education. M Phil is not required to do P.HD which would really encourage the many students to do P.HD. Multiple entries and exit from higher education are also beneficial for the students.

    Adult education is also given importance in NEP. So, we can also give the full mark to this NEP. 6% of GDP would be given to education before it was only 1.7%.

    Regular health check-up is mandatory for every student and an up to date record would be maintained for it. We never go for a regular check-up for our children. We always visit a physician when there is a problem. But due to NEP, there is a regular check-up and we would be able to remove the many medical problems of student in very early stages. Like malnutrition, eye problem, anaemia, etc.

    I would continue my opinion in my next responses.

    Honesty is the best policy.

  • #706525
    Mr Rao
    In your #706483, you have said "A 10 years kid need not handle a big hammer. But he can see a hammer and he can understand how it can be used. The students will be oriented more towards the application part of the theory what they have studied."

    Let us know how long a child student will look at the figure of a hammer in the book to learn the theory part of the vocational training. Will he be looking at the hammer figure for the entire three years from his 9 th to 11 th years of tender age? Don't you think it would a funny class?

    No life without Sun

  • #706550
    The word holistic is repeated as such probably due to the vagueness it hold. It is ironical that when the word is used in the context 'holistic therapy' then such practitioners as booed as unscientific peddlers and fake practitioners. But it is as if neo revolutionary term when it is used in NEP and similar places.

    In the NEP in para 4.4 it is said" Specific sets of skills and values across domains will be identified for integration and incorporation at each stage of learning, from pre-school to higher education." All these days experience and research did not identify these skills? Are they something new? But already in many schools arts, craft, music etc are being taught even now. The word education itself means 'to Educe' or to draw latent talents. There are various facilities and opportunities in schools like youth festival, school annual days, other important days etc. to bring out and find out talents. While I was studying we had a drawing class as one session every week. In my school days every Friday the last period (45 minutes) was allotted for arts and related matters. Students can perform as per their likes and talents and students will be mentored and guided properly in the relevant fields. These were later removed for teaching other neo subjects. As wisely said, history repeats itself.(Are we retrograde?)

    Para 4.7: "As a part of the thrust on experiential learning, art-integrated education will be embedded in classroom transactions not only for creating joyful classrooms, but also for imbibing the Indian ethos through integration of Indian art and culture in the teaching and learning process at every level. This art-integrated approach will strengthen the linkages between education and culture." Unfortunately the secular and 'scientific' section will not allow this to happen. They had stopped many traditional festivities and events blaming them as orthodox. Celebrations and participation of children even in the Janmashtami festivities is booed by the neo or pseudo secularists. So any cultural education will be opposed for the sake of negation bybiased sectons.

    Para 4.8:"..Sports-integration is another cross-curricular pedagogical approach that utilizes physical activities including indigenous sports, in pedagogical practices to help in developing skills..." Is it not just verbose? Children get basic familiarisation and initiative in schools (probably except in city schools where play ground spaces not available). The necessity is not adding sports in curriculum, but keeping it as extra curriculum and creating more play grounds, athletic tracks, and indoor/outdoor courts for games.

  • #706551
    #706519 :highlights one common examination. The existing common entrance exams of JEE and NEET are still not unanimously accepted by some states and they still voice their protests periodically. There are state level institutions and those under self financing category. Even now in Kerala it is a struggle every year to reach some understanding with these SFCs and students los prescious time in an academic year due to multiple litigations.

    Once the NEP 20 is implemented, in the scenario of more autonomous colleges and universities, the relevance of common entrance examinations may not be smooth and effective. Moreover the move will be opposed by states as it will be more interference and dilution of the state's role in education.

    M Phil and Ph .D. This is not of any significance at all. The Ph.D itself is losing its value as it is given just like participation certificates. The number ofPh.D being awarded ever day may total more than pass in class 1.The standard)quality) has been lowered to a pitiable extent. With this it may reduce a little more. It needs a special focus exclusively and away from the cursory general discussion on overall NEP.

    It is still vague what will be thestructure of controlling body as there will be merging and/o abolishing existing bodies.

  • #706554
    I want to say here that NEP 2020 is out and it is to be implemented soon. The results of the new policy will be definitely good when it will be in force. Some of the members have given the reference of Kothari commission. I want to say here, that if the system given in Kothari commission was good and the new policy is also similar at many points to that then where is the problem? Nowadays parents are more aware. When a new thing comes in the market whether it is technology or anything people take it seriously and hand in hand. This policy has so many good points which will definitely be beneficial for children.
    The policy has a more practical approach to creative, innovative and personal as well as professional development.
    It aims to achieve 100% youth and adult literacy and Government has increased the amount of investment (6% of GDP) on education in this new policy hence, definitely something new will be developed.
    The teacher recruitment process will be improved. A teacher training board will also be set up for the teachers.
    The self-evaluation process will be there in schools.
    Duration of all graduate courses will be four years that will give sufficient time to students for strengthening the grip on the subject.
    Credit transfer system will be there and if a student will have a break in the study he can avail the benefit of his previously earned credits.
    All institutes whether government, private, deemed university, deemed to be university, open university of vocational training institutes will have the same grading pattern and regulations.

    All these features will be definitely beneficial for all.

  • #706556
    I was going through the various opinion of some eminent educationists. The Vice-Chancellor of Jadavpur University has outrightly criticised the NEP 2020. One statement that is education will be skill-oriented has attracted a whole lot of young people without even analysing all the details of the policy.

    Today I all of a sudden remembered that my son learnt to solder and circuit building in class 6th that means some six years ago. Sometimes his fingers got little burnt, accidentally spoiled his tiffin box and some or the other. It was a common feature with other children too. So, a probability of some danger is always present, why should one take a risk at such a tender age? A kid cannot walk the day it is born, that means everything needs to begin at a certain age. Class sixth students are not fit for handling tools which can hamper them. My son told me that for him and his classmates, those classes were a break from theoretical classes, that's why they enjoyed. It was just fun and not sincere learning. Ultimately what did they learn? Nothing at all other than remembering the activity. The Education policy must stress upon skill training from 11th onwards.

    My son studied in a private school which had many other activity classes, and sports was an integral part too. What I loved about his school was to make students a good reader. They promoted reading books and gave merit certificates after maintaining a record of each student by taking story tests. It started from Montessori to tenth class. First few years it was compulsory for all, and after the primary section, it was on students' choice. It helped my son to inculcate the habit of reading books. His school promoted music, dance, art, and sports along with regular competitions. It benefits the overall development of a child. Later it helps a child to judge what is right for him and what one wants to pursue in future accordingly a student can choose the skill-based classes.

    shampasaid

  • #706563
    Some members have give some good points in the favour of the new educational policy but our country is not a small one that we can implement things in such a unique way. Local perturbations would always be there to deform the policy to quite some extent. I remember there was a time when people used to think seriously about developing the local languages in the sense that broadly languages in our country could be categorised in two main parts. One is Southern languages and other is Northern languages. If we follow this broad classification then it makes sense to include one of the languages from one group as an optional one to the other group so that the students from their childhood understand these things that there are so many languages here and they have to coexist. In European countries it is very common to know 2-3 languages out of so many in use in Europe. So the point I want to drive is that new education policy would have to incorporate these factors also in its implementation otherwise the language agitations and protests would become more aggressive in the coming times. There are many other points which would arise during the implementation of these new policies and due to that I have my fearful apprehensions for its glorious success as being envisaged by some of the members in favour of it.
    Knowledge is power.

  • #706576
    If we remember our olden days, A son will be observing how his father is working with gold and he used to learn slowly and by 18 years he used to get the expertise in that position. Initially, for some years they will be observing how the things are being done and once he became matured enough he will start doing on his own. That is how a father became a teacher to his son and taught a skill. The same way vocational education will go on. It is not that Vocational course means handling big equipment alone. They should learn the technic by observation and then by doing they will become experts.
    drrao
    always confident

  • #706578
    My final argument against a few of the point under the NEP2020:
    1. Adaptability in the education system and reconciliation of vocational/professional training with school training have been pet topics of the RSS and its sister outfits.
    2. The demand for education in the mother tongue will push our kids behind in the global arena. Here it is nothing to do with nationalism or patriotism, it is simply your ability to compete in the market and prove that you are smart than others.
    3. Renaming of the ministry as it was done in 1985 by Rajiv Gandhi would not affect much by this is what was secretly demanded in the meeting in 2018, but this is being done in the name of Indian culture by adding 'Shiksha' word to the ministry.
    4. Foreign universities will be coming to India, what happened to the 'Swadeshi' slogan.
    5. The NEP2020 first u-turn comes just after 4 days of the announcement of the policy. No force over State in respect to language to be taught till 5th class.

    Regards,
    Nadeem Naqvi


    World without God is Zero without One!

  • #706582
    #706551
    Yes, I agree that most of the states have not accepted, but ultimately it is not in the favour of the students. If a student has talents he should be eligible to take admission in any state. If are saying that we are Indian then why we are going to be Madhya Pradesian, Rajasthani, Karnataki, Tamilian, etc. I support the common interest test as it is beneficial to the students and all the talented and deserving student will be admitted for higher classes.

    As you have said M. Phill and PhD have no significance at all. Yes, I agree. But what are the reasons behind It? The main reason is our education policy. The present education policy has not any measures to develop the skill in the student. Due to lack of skills, they fail in higher education. But due to the new education policy, practical knowledge would be provided from lower classes and it would really help in the developing of skills like thinking skill, writing skill, etc. After passing 12 std (5+3+3+4) the students would have practical knowledge and would have different skills. His thesis would be totally different and innovative which would help in the development of India.

    Honesty is the best policy.

  • #706595
    I am in favour of the recent system being introduced by NEP. The recent formulation provides the scope of vocational training in the different trades such as Plumber, Fitter, Turner, Electrician , Black - smith courses once they complete their classes five. In the present system of education, this important step has been ignored though this is the vital component in learning the different trades. From the existing provision, we can produce engineers with their excellent performance in their streams but the unfortunate part is that he is nowhere in his production unit unless he is familiar with job being done in the Forging Shop, Machine Shop etc and being a Mechanical Engineer, ignorance of carrying out such jobs with his own hand will deprive him of the difficulty associated with such jobs. He may not appreciate the problem while undertaking such jobs. In absence of non reporting of the efficient trade man, the job will remain pending unless a trademan specialised in the same field appears in the next shift. With the existing education, engineers will have better confidence level in tackling the critical circumstances.
    Though at the initial phase, it looks good providing deep inputs of practical knowledge, this has to be seen how this is being reviewed with the expert committee.

  • #706612
    There are apprehensions in the minds of the people that the new policy would not see the light of the day and would go as a wasteful exercise. It is actually not so. There has been a long deliberations and discussions among the qualified and responsible people to work out the knitty-gritty of the new envisaged system and the Govt is very serious and sincere to go for the modifications and reforms in the existing policy. The path of modification and progress is always like that and beforehand we cannot conclude that nothing would work. There are so many policies which are working to the benefit and advantage of the poor and downtrodden in the country and a large part of population is acknowledging it. So policies are made and then tested and implemented for our benefit only. I strongly have the view that the new policy would be for the betterment of educational sector in our country.
    Thoughts exchanged is knowledge gained.

  • #706630
    The time is running out and the participants may now shift to the top gear. Good going!
    “It is better to change an opinion than to persist in the wrong one." – Socrates

  • #706639
    Yesterday I was away from the site for a long time and could not even participate in this GD. Today I have seen various arguments.
    The policy has been brought after a lot of deliberation among various high profile academicians, scientists and industrialists with a strong background. All the points proposed are good and I strongly say that if we implement all the points properly, India will be a country with a very good education system and our students will get recognised as best students in the entire world. There are chances to attract many foreign students also to our country for our education.
    The government should take all possible steps to implement the system in totality. The uphill task will be to get a proper faculty and that can be managed by hiring people from the industry by paying honorarium and they can be asked to work for some hours in a week.
    I will agree that the proposed system is very good for the country.

    drrao
    always confident

  • #706642
    Well, putting the policy on paper is always easier than implementing it in toto. The other point is those who are speaking/writing against the new education policy is not just about having any apprehension regarding the implementation of it. It is about right or wrong. I am dead against of skill-based education from class sixth.

    Next is, learning in the mother tongue and studying mother tongue in school is a different aspect altogether. English should not be ignored because it has a global outreach. Some members opined that subjects become easy to learn if taught in the mother tongue. Let me agree with you, but I have a doubt. When in the class sixth, the medium of teaching changes, then, will the students be able to understand the lessons completely? In higher studies, the reference books are available in English, so it will be tough for the students to understand the chapters. Again they would like to have a coaching class.

    How to develop fluency in English? It's a matter of concern if English lose prominence. It is the need of the hour. To speak without hesitation, one needs to practise the language, but it will be missing. One can't deny the importance of English, but at this juncture, planning to ignore English will prove dangerous.

    Being a Bengali, I never studied Bangla language in school. It was my father who took the initiative to teach my mother tongue. I learnt it at home. So parents have a prominent role to play in the teaching of mother tongue, for that school doesn't require to teach it.

    Kindly do not keep a one-track mind that the education policy is right just because it gives stress on skill teaching. We should not ignore the consequences.

    shampasaid

  • #706650
    Now, I want to conclude my views as below:

    1. From the above discussion it is clear that NEP is really beneficial for the development of India and for the sack of students.

    2. Practical knowledge, vocation education, adult education, digital library, etc are important features to develop different skills in the students.

    3. The primary education in mother tongue will help the students and parents to understand the concept more easily.

    4. Teachres training would help in making good teachers and skilled students after completing their higher education.

    5. As it is clear from my views in the earlier responses that this education policy will help in removing many economic and social problems indirectly.

    6. Common entrance test would be helpful for the talented students to get admission in desired colleges. If the talented student will get admission, it would help in making India developed nation.

    7. reduction in the weight of bags, reduced syllabus and less stress on the students are the most important features of the NEP.


    But, after all it is necessary that this policy must be implemented with proper planning and by taking all the CM of the different states of India in confidence. The proper implementation of the NEP would provide us with sweet fruits in the future. We are ready for testing the sweetness of this NEP.

    Honesty is the best policy.

  • #706651
    #706578
    I want to clarify the following points:
    1. The GD is here to discuss about the outcomes of NEP 2020, not ideology about any organization. Anyway I want to tell you that RSS is very much progressive and adaptive to each and every step of government. They are also following CBSE syllabus in their schools. All the changes mentioned in the NEP 2020 like vocational/professional training with school training are for welfare of children. These changes will benefit them in long-run. We should not merge ideology and theism and casteism to the welfare of society intentionally.

    2. & 5. Education in the mother tongue is being added for the convenience of the children so that creative thinking can be developed because a child may have some difficulty in understanding any subject in a different language and I think nationalism and patriotism are very important that must be developed among children since starting. As far as "U-turn" on the announcement regarded language is concerned, it must be noted that in the NEP it is clearly mentioned that "Wherever possible, the medium of instruction until at least Grade 5, but preferably till Grade 8 and beyond, will be the home language, mother tongue, local language or the regional language. Thereafter, the home or local language shall continue to be taught as a language wherever possible. This will be followed by both public and private schools." But several States and educationist had raised the question that's why they clarified it as "Children have a great ability to pick up multiple languages in early age. The policy talks about a flexible approach in three-language formula. How it will be implemented in states its their decision. No language is being imposed in the policy".

    3. I don't think so that renaming is a matter of discussion. It doesn't matter it is MHRD or Education Ministry.

    4. If foreign university will be coming to India( another important feature of NEP 2020), will definitely in welfare of students. As now each year around 8 lakh students join foreign university for higher education. But if the foreign universities will come and setup their campuses in India, it will improve the quality of education, stop migration of students and brain drain. The student will join courses in these top 100 foreign university campuses. Of course these foreign university will follow the rules regulation of Indian government. It will also give a boost to the Swedeshi slogon. Students will study here and later will work here.

  • #706653
    @#706554 " if the system given in Kothari commission was good and the new policy is also similar at many points to that then where is the problem? ". The comparison of Kothari commission is taken to show that NEP2020 contains nothing revolutionary nor does it propose any radical change. While it acknowledges that" The global education development agenda reflected in the Goal 4 (SDG4) of the 2030 Agenda for Sustainable Development, adopted by India in 2015 - seeks to "ensure inclusive and equitable quality education and promote lifelong learning opportunities for all" by 2030 ", it almost ignores the previous policies and Kothari Commission and just give a passing reference just in four lines. Usually such policies sincerely and fact fully refer, analyse and narrate about what was done and not done by them and explain the new changes proposed. NEP2020 in its eagerness to project as a very new and radical policy uses words very cleverly to make it convincing by camouflaging cleverly with words." This National Education Policy 2020 is the first education policy of the 21st century and aims to address the many growing developmental imperatives of our country. "
    No one can dispute. The other policies were in the 20th century. How clever!!

  • #706655
    Multilingualism and the power of language:
    I do not want to say anything on this. It is going to be a Pandora's box. Already amendments had been made from the draft due to 'vocal' opposition. More may follow. The less said the better.

    Jargons and popular verbose:

    The NEP2020 looks like a propaganda brochure only. Full of ideal looking verbose. For example what is the real actionable meaning of "a 'light but tight' regulatory framework to ensure integrity, transparency, and resource efficiency of the educational system through audit and public disclosure while encouraging innovation and out-of-the-box ideas through autonomy, good governance, and empowerment; "?

    Just as the governments used to say- the law will take its course. No one will escape etc. Have the policy makers understand the various provisions and protections now available and availed by many in this sector?

    Many things proposed need amendments and updates to various existing laws, constitutional clauses and provisions etc. For all these legislative approval is necessary. But the NEP2020 was not discussed by the legislatures and Parliament. So as of now NEP2020 looks like a private members bill made known for jut propaganda and getting attention.

    I do not understand what was the urgency for the cabinet to accept and announce it now, when all the education institutions are close for past six months and more. Without NEP2020 Covid has brought drastic revolutionary changes in the education sector not just in India but all over the country. Sit gives a doubt that it is a political document.

    The aim of the policy to make education to a national standard is fraught with many political questions of propriety and federal relationship of states and centre. The present central government is seen to be favouring private business and multinational corporate entry. So it is to be see with real concern that the policy will be only be bringing just opposite effect of what is ideally aimed in the document. Education will be getting much costlier even from nursery stage and the 'Elite' institutions will try to exploit the situation in their favour.

    Everyone knows that even before the first brick was laid, the government had given "Institution of Eminence' to some unproven organisation. These same business houses and groups are only going to get benefited under the new NEP2020.

  • #706659
    Sorry, I could not say anything much in this discussion. But I would simply conclude and say
    1. This NEP 20 should have waited for the COVID-19s end.
    2. The government has hurried to pass the bill while the educational institutions are closed for business.
    3. The three-language formula is to force Hindi learning in non-Hindi states. Its introduction from class 1 to 5 would affect the students in learning good English. This issue was not discussed by any member.
    4. The vocational training to the students at the tender age is undesirable.
    5. The board examination after 3, 5 and 8 class is not appropriate.
    6. An entrance examination for higher studies is like NEET examination. This paves way for many tuition institutions that levies heavy fees.
    7. The introduction of breakfast for students is an election gimmick to attract voters. It is an unwanted item in NEP 20.
    8. While there are appreciations, there are also equal oppositions to NEP 20.

    Since this is only a draft, it needs to be discussed in length to make a final draft with many proposals for amendments.
    Jai Hind.

    No life without Sun

  • #706661
    Since we are running out of time, I'd like to quickly conclude on why the new education policy makes sense to me and why I support it.

    1. It fits with India's investment in IT and software service industry. By introducing concepts of soft skills to students at young age and making concrete conceptual learning, is a good measure.

    2. Languages that students learn also goes through a shift. Sanskrit is going to focussed upon. Regional langauges will be given more importance.

    3. GATE and other entrance exams are now tailored for a student population from a variety of disciplines and streams. Addition of basic sciences into engineering and other disciplines is being done.

    4. I feel that this education system is a tight slap on colleges like Narayana and Chaitanya that soley producers rote learners for lakhs of fees. Robotic learning will be reduced with 10+2 system that might come into every city.

    5. This system came into being with a pandemic situation. So we can be assured that when in future a similar catastrophe strikes we students will be ready. Smart learning and online learning are going to be pushed to newer horizons with this new education policy. Already plenty of promises in this regard have been made. Let's hope that they will be fulfilled.

    6. When every institution is made to follow the same set of rules, some monopolising bigger institutions will be less valued. Because one can get the same kind of education anywhere. In theory. Promises are plenty but implementations must be made.

    I find this new policy very fascinating.

    The stronger a light shines the darker are the shadows around it.

  • #706670
    Now let us take the point of flexibility in course choices
    NEP Para4.9: Holistic development and a wide choice of subjects and courses year to year will be the new distinguishing feature of secondary school education. There will be no hard separation among 'curricular', 'extracurricular ', or 'co-curricular', among 'arts', 'humanities', and 'sciences', or between 'vocational' or 'academic' streams. Subjects such as physical education, the arts and crafts, and vocational skills, in addition to science, humanities, and mathematics, will be incorporated throughout the school curriculum, with a consideration for what is interesting and safe at each age.In one word it can be said that things are going to be messy. Again, just verbose.
    Evening my school days at 8 th class we had options to chose typewriting, book keeping, Special English etc. Still earlier there was choice for tailoring, mat weaving etc. Even now schools have such subjects under productivity. In languages we had choice of Sanskrit, Arabic, Malayalam etc. The language choice continues in many schools.
    "There will be no hard separation among 'curricular', 'extracurricular ', or 'co-curricular', among 'arts', 'humanities', and 'sciences', or between 'vocational' or 'academic' streams". Even now there is no hard separation as arts, humanities and sciences upo 10th class. This they want to extent to 11& 12th too. I will say this as retrograde. Why should a student who had acquired some core knowledge(as per this NEP itself) learn unwanted subjects ? Why can't they be given their choice when they are at an age capable to choose? Even in our times we had a ""drill period" which in now known as PT. That was part of the academic time table. When there is no distinguishing as curricular or extracurricular, how the students are going to be assessed? That means they have to score in everything prescribed?
    Or does it mean that students who dislike Maths can choose music or badminton and forget about Maths from then on?
    More confusing is the subsequent explanation "Subjects such as physical education, the arts and crafts, and vocational skills, in addition to science, humanities, and mathematics, will be incorporated throughout the school curriculum, with a consideration for what is interesting and safe at each age."( First saying no hard separation among 'curricular', 'extracurricular ', or 'co-curricular' and then saying , will be incorporated throughout the school curriculum,) My head is spinning.
    Middlestage
    "internship opportunities to learn vocational subjects may be made available to students throughout Grades 6-12, including holiday periods. Vocational courses through online mode will also be made available. Bagless days will be encouraged throughout the year for various types of enrichment activities involving arts, quizzes, sports, and vocational crafts. Children will be given periodic exposure to activities outside school through visits to places/monuments of historical, cultural and tourist importance, meeting local artists and craftsmen and visits higher educational institutions in their village/Tehsil/District/State."
    Study tours and excursions are even now there. In my school days we were taken to such tours an visits. We were taken to the (then) Tata Soap factory in our district. It is good. But will the teachers and students get days after the umpteen numbers of protests, strikes, hartals and even teachers union activities? The holidays are also going to get spoiled .By and by this will get stopped. No use of bag less days. Children have to carry water bottle, snacks, and now mobile phones too. So their bags will be still heavy. In government schools vulnerable section students are given food, snacks etc. free. School canteens will be highly costly in private institutions.
    ""Knowledge of India" will include knowledge from ancient India and its contributions to modern India and its successes and challenges, and a clear sense of India's future aspirations with regard to education, health, environment, etc. These elements will be incorporated in an accurate and scientific manner throughout the school curriculum wherever relevant;"- a place for political blame game. The syllabus and lessons will go on changing as per the governments at the helm in states or centre. Lessons will be doctored propaganda material of respective political thinking only.
    Secondary stage:
    Secondary Stage-, covering ages 14-18. (Grades 9-12) consists of two phases, i.e., 9 and 10 in the first and 11 and 12 in the second. The Secondary Stage will comprise of four years of multidisciplinary study, building on the subject-oriented pedagogical and curricular style of the Middle Stage, but with greater depth, greater critical thinking, greater attention to life aspirations, and greater flexibility and student choice of subjects. In particular students would continue to have the option of exiting after Grade 10and re-entering in the next phase to pursue vocational or any other courses available in Grades 11-12, including at a more specialized school, if so desired.
    Is it not what is happening even now? Where is the change and novelty?

  • #706673
    #5.
    I would like to conclude to the GD on NEP 2020 with the following points:
    1. As the National Education Policy 2020 replaces the 34-year old National Policy on Education (NPE), that was drafted in 1986, we will have to at least wait for a year or two to check on its implementation as many have questioned and compared the former NPE as it was not effectively implemented. Unless it is given time, we cannot talk about its implementation in the present scenario.

    2. The old school curricula of 5+5+2+3/4 to be replaced by a 5+3+3+4 i.e. ages 3-8, 8-11, 11-14, and 14-18 years which is an advantage as many countries do not consider our 3 years degree system so this will be a plus point for students wanting to fly abroad for further studies or work.

    3. The minimum qualification for teaching will be a 4-year integrated B.Ed. degree and a common National Professional Standards for Teachers (NPST) in discussion with NCERT, SCERTs, teachers and expert organizations from across levels and regions will be developed by 2022 by the National Council for Teacher Education(NCTE).

    4. Every education institutions(Government or private schools, college or institutions) will be governed by the same set of regulation, accreditation and academic standards.

    5. National Educational Technology Forum (NETF) will be the autonomous body to check, provide and enhance learning, assessment, planning, administration with the latest technology in teaching.

    6. Giving importance to mother tongue/state or regional language will help children to be in line with the local and know it than as many do not like learning their mother tongue.

    7. Vocational education will help children to have practical knowledge according to their age and class and the usage of tools, machines, equipment and other things which are learned easily and be used in practical life.

    8. Removing the compulsory formate and making subject selection flexible will help children to learn their passion along with their class which is not in the present scenario.

    9. Giving importance to Sanskrit will help children to learn our epic and history which were not as commonly preferred by many children or parents but this will be an add-on.

    10. The new assessment through Performance Assessment, Review, and Analysis of Knowledge for Holistic Development(PARAKH) will help students to get good and improved grades, will assess the student from for their real interest and strength than just focusing on the memorising and practical understanding of the subject.

    I like the initial draft of the new education policy(NEP) 2020 even though it is a mixture of old but we need to give at least 1-2 years for its proper implementation and then can have debate again as part-2 on the same topic.

    “The most important thing in life is to learn how to give out love, and to let it come in." — Morrie Schwartz

  • #706677
    Teachers
    "Teacher Eligibility Tests (TETs) will be strengthened to inculcate better test material, both in terms of content and pedagogy. The TETs will also be extended to cover teachers across all stages (Foundational, Preparatory, Middle and Secondary) of school education. For subject teachers, suitable TET or NTA test scores in the corresponding subjects will also be taken into account for recruitment. "

    This is going t be the most difficult and controversial matter. Teacher's recruitment is one of the most lucrative businesses now. It is in this that there is high political and vested interest thrives and profit. Those who are enjoying the benefits will not be ready to lose. There will be long queue of litigations and even vocal and express protests.
    The first communist government in Kerala did something and we can see how it became upside down and the same communists now encourage self financing colleges and private and political recruitment. Teachers unions are a big strength to the Leftist parties in Kerala.
    -----------------------------
    CONCLUSION

    I am now compelled to conclude my discussion this GD due to deadline.
    I do not see anything new in NEP2020.

    • It does not propose and hence will not bring any radical changes in our education system.

    • It is announced at a wrong time, especially when the educational institutions are closed, exams are abandoned and automatic explosive changes are happening in education system as per need of the situation. This only makes us doubt that the timing is deliberately chosen to easily avoid threadbare discussion when people are engrossed in their life and livelihood matters.

    • A matter which is in concurrent list of States and Centre and needs many legislative changes is announced to the public without discussing in legislatures and Parliament. This can affect the smoothness and fate of the needed legislative requirements.

    • There is no basic change in system proposed. It is just a change of name and re-bracketing of categories. The NEP only makes formalisation and mandating of the till now choice of pre-school education. That can only take away the precious time and period of umbilical attachment time for children to their parents. Children will be groomed as human robots devoid of their own unque characteristics and ethnicity.

    • The idea of our institutions spreading abroad is just Utopian. We have seen what happened in our liberalisation and globalisation. Our markets got flooded with unnecessary foreign goods and our manufacturing stopped. Same fate may happen to our educational institutions.

    • The NEP moves to a common syllabus, common earn and a national curriculum. This will rob the federal characteristics and the unity in diversity of Indian culture and tradition. The syllabus will be interfered with the political parties in power as per their bias.

    • There are constitutional provisions for minority institutions, religious institutions. It will not be easy to bring them under 'light and tight' controls. There will be a train of litigations.

    • Even the leftist governments support private business in education. So what can be expected of a government already selling profitable public sector companies to private? Education sector will be dominated by private and multinational corporate and will be the most costly thing as it is in some western countries. The class difference will only widen.

    • The flexibility for enter and exit will only push out the vulnerable away from higher education as they will be the first victims of causes.

    • The choice in curriculum subjects will help to reduce standards and the students will be changing subjects like hopping butterflies, and will not be thorough in any subject. It will need lot of confusion in teachers, teaching and conducting of teaching and exams.
      The telescopic continuity in secondary and higher secondary is already in vogue in VHSE in some state.

    • We need more dedicated specialists who can innovate and create rather than more Jack-of-alls who can just copy or follow.

    • NEP 200 is not even original in thoughts, has not conducted any original discussion and research, but copied from the UN Education by 2030 aims and filled the pages with the unimplemented policy aims of previous policies and reports. It does not specify its action course or action programme.

    • There is not even a single proposal which can make a paradigm change in education system.

    • Overall the NEP2020 document is more like a propaganda brochure and political document with verbose and vagueness camouflaging as a radical progressive policy and vision.


    • I appreciate the sincere efforts of the participants who came in support of NEP2020, as more loyal than the 'policy makers' themselves.
      Thanks to all participants and moderators.

  • #706682
    It is generally noted that due to the RTE policy students were able to get admission directly to the first standard, this was a great difficulty both for the students and the teachers.

    Students who joined just as their age was of first grade, could not even hold a pencil, not able to mingle with friends initially. Whereas the other students who started their early education from montessori, kindergarten to first grade were able to follow the teacher, takes notes and move ahead leaving these students far behind.

    The policy implemented by NEP stated that the students have to attend Pre-Kg, Lkg and Ukg classes before they reach the first standard is a good decision for the overall improvement in the field of education for a child to flourish ahead. Kindergarten students learn to use a pencil, identify the letters, learn discipline which is necessary when he or she reaches grade one.

    Lead the leader

  • #706684
    Now I am concluding the GD with the following remarks:

    NEP 2020 has several important features which will lead to big benefits like

    1. The undergraduate degree will be of either 3 or 4-year duration with subject flexibility and multiple exit options which will reduce the stress as well as a dropout.

    2. Right to Education is extended to 18 years to ensure free education till the age of 18 years. It will also reduce dropout caused due to various factors.

    3. A basic learning programme for parents of children aged up to three years will be launched in their respective homes.

    4. Preschool education will commence from the age of 3 to the age of six years.

    5. Students will learn education in their mother tongue or regional language till class 5.

    6. Introduction of vocational training and internship from Class VI is a big move which will lead to skill development among children from an early age and will also help in future.

    7. Freedom to choose subjects from class 8 to 12 will allow children to choose their favourite subjects.

    8. A four-year degree will give enough time to students to master the subjects.

    9. There will be a major and minor subject which will also reduce pressure on the students.

    10. All universities whether it is a private or government will have the same grading pattern and regulations.

    11. School examination will run semester wise ( Exams twice a year)

    12. Credit transfer system will be there which will benefit the students who will have a break in their career.

    13. A single governing body for higher education Institute. i.e. Higher Education Council of India (HECI)
    Improve Teaching Training.

    14. More focus will be on the upgradation of technology and digital empowerment of schools.

    Overall, the new Education Policy 2020 will be a good package for all students, parents as well as teachers. Everyone will be benefitted by it.

  • #706687
    After a lengthy discussion on the NEP 2020, it's time to conclude my stand.

    In my first response to the group discussion, I mentioned that every policy has some merits and demerits. One cannot reject it entirely. Although the new education policy talks about making the youths self-reliant, I oppose their stand firmly. From class sixth, if the students receive skill training, then it is not at all a right decision. No government has the right to push children so early into a skill-based training.

    Learning the mother tongue is good, but parents can manage it well. The teaching of English should not suffer. We are talking about globalisation, and the language that connects across the globe is not getting importance.

    Some members said that if foreign universities begin functioning in India, then it will be an achievement for the NEP 2020. Earlier in one of my response, I have mentioned that the standard of the universities will not be at par with their international branch established long back.

    Many Indians went to foreign due to having a job there, so brain drain cannot be stopped by opening foreign universities. Life seems to become more complicated for students due to too many board examinations.

    IITs to become multi-disciplinary, which means it would lose its original character. Such institutions should not be spoiled through mix and match.

    Finally, I would say that I don't think the NEP 2020 will deliver the desired result. It has many loopholes, which need to be plugged well.

    Thank you all for having a great group discussion.

    shampasaid


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