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  • Category: Foreign Affairs
    Points:5

    A Timeline of Israel: We must know the History

    Jewish people have been living in the sacred land of Israel since 2000 BC. Here is the timeline which clearly indicates the bond between the Jews and Israel.

    1. 1900 BC: Era of Abraham, Father of the Jewish Nation.
    2. 1900 BC: Isaac, Abraham's son, rules over Israel.
    3. 1850 BC: Jacob, son of Isaac, rules over Israel.
    4. 1400 BC: Moses leads the people out of Egypt and back to Israel.
    5. 1010 BC: King David unites the 12 tribes into one nation.
    6. 970 BC: King Solomon, son of David, builds the first temple structure in Jerusalem
    7. 930 BC: Israel is divided into two kingdoms, the Kingdom of Israel and the Kingdom of Judah.
    8. 722 BC: The Kingdom of Israel is conquered by Assyrians.
    9. 605 BC: Kingdom Judah is conquered by the Babylonians.
    10. 586 BC: Solomon's Temple is destroyed by the Babylonians.
    11. 539 BC: Persians conquered the Babylonians and took control of Israel.
    12. 538 BC: The Jews return to Israel from exile.
    13. 520 BC: The Temple is rebuilt. 450 BC: Reforms made by Ezra and Nehemiah.
    14. 432 BC: The last group of Jews returned from exile.
    15. 333 BC: The Greeks conquered the Persian empire.
    16. 323 BC: The Egyptian and Syrian empires take over Israel.
    17. 167 BC: Hasmoneans recapture Israel, and the Jews are ruled independently.
    18. 70 BC: Romans conquered Israel.
    19. 20 BC: King Herod builds the "second" temple
    20. 70 AD: Romans destroy the temple.
    21. After 70 AD, Israelis were captives of the Romans, Byzantines, Arabs, and Crusaders. In spite of all these upheavals and setbacks, the Jews continued to live in Israel. There were more or less of them, depending on the centuries, but there was never a time when the Jews did not live in the land. They stayed, they developed their communities, they raised their families.
    22. In 1948, the UN established the State of Israel, the nation of Jews.

    After understanding the timeline, let us discuss a question.

    Shouldn't the Jews have any right to live in this Ancient Land?
  • #775510

    Points:5
    History is a great subject. By going through the history about a place or about a society we learn a great deal and understand the things in present context. Many students preparing for competitive examinations take history as a subject because it inculcates a lot of knowledge and information in them.
    The history of Israel is full of conflicts and confrontations with the nearby states and with some other aggressive countries and Israelis were troubled by some offensive communities who always liked to take the land of Israel from them and oust them from the area.
    But the people of Israel are very brave, bold, and very knowledgeable and the progress of Israel in the last few decades is phenomenal. Today it is not easy to defeat Israel in the war whoever tries it.
    Every society has right to live in its original place and there is no dispute about that and Israelis also have a full right for living in that part of the land and it was already approved by United Nations.
    Knowledge is power.

  • #775512

    Points:4
    I think such restrictions should be avoided. Any person belonging to any religion or community should be allowed to live any place they like. As we progress much technologically, these cross border differences should vanish. But there should not be any special privileges for any community in the guise of minority. This should be universally followed.
    The author has narrated briefly the history of Israel. I feel Jews should have every right to stay in this part of the world.
    The main objective of the expected invasion of the Gaza Strip will be the destruction of the Hamas government and terror group. We may witness many more deaths in this process.
    Thanks to the author for the history giving all the happenings.
    drrao
    always confident

  • #775527

      

    Points:2
    'Shouldn't the Jews have any right to live in this ancient land'? Is that the real issue Partha? Please be specific if you have an answer and do avoid this query if you can't. Having created sufficient issues internally, I think neo-historians are out to wieve and create history across the world as per their convenience.
    'Educating the mind without educating the heart is no education at all'.
    -Aristotle

  • #775535

    Points:4

    The real core question is what is the threshold line of history?
    The goal posts(history period) is changed a super one's bias and interest.

    In one case for achieving or reclaiming or, something or fixing back, the history is just seventy five years. But the same party or supporting sides may take history threshold back to a few hundred years in another case.
    Unless there is a specific quantification of history and fixing at a certain deadline figure, there will be always difference of opinion and claims and counterclaims.

    Now history is fixed as per that side's interest and that also can vary from case to case. It is also proving might is right along with mighty and well designed propaganda too.

  • #775537

    Points:1
    Saji Sir has asked: "'Shouldn't the Jews have any right to live in this ancient land'? Is that the real issue Partha? "-----------------------Yes, Saji Sir. That is the real issue, core issue. I think I can't be more specific than this.

    Saji Sir has also stated: "I think neo-historians are out to wieve and create history across the world as per their convenience."----------- Now Saji Sir is required to be more specific. Does he want to say that the timeline given above is not correct? Does he want to mean that the Jews living in the sacred land of Israel since time immemorial a figment of imagination?
    Billo Rani kahon to abhi jaan de doon: Oh dear Billo, if you ask, I will give my life

  • #775548

    Points:2
    Whatever the conflict is going on should be settled peacefully if there is a room for the same. Though I understand that this process is not that much easy to take both the parties including the opponent one into the confidence.
    When we are witnessing the disturbances across the world with the ongoing of multiple wars, this needs to curbed with the rational approaches.

  • #775549

    Points:1
    Jha Sir: There is no scope of peace with terrible sub-humans (worse than beasts) who kill, maim, rape, murder unborn children, burn alive small children and finally destroy their own hospital to blame the other side, with perverse pleasure. The humanity must exterminate these sub-humans for real peace.

    War is very often necessary to establish peace in this Kaliyuga.
    Billo Rani kahon to abhi jaan de doon: Oh dear Billo, if you ask, I will give my life

  • #775573

      

    Points:2
    Does history say something about the claim over Jerusalem by Israel and the the way they have tried to dominate? Hamas, is no doubt a terrorist group, but what about Israel? What gives them the upperhand? Members like Partha who are interested in history may like to analyse and post their opinions.
    'Educating the mind without educating the heart is no education at all'.
    -Aristotle

  • #775585

      

    Points:5
    Some of them are right here. But one sided story as generally we find around thus don't agree with each other due to superiority or incomplete info etc.

    Prophet Abraham actually got two wives and the third one is concubine (It was general and legal at that time). Sarah (First wife) Daughter of Terah (Prophet / King) - got first kid (when she was old) Isaac after the second wife's (Hagira, daughter of Egypt King - younger compared to Sara) son Ismael. All were together before Isaac. Isaac's clan called Bani-Israel (lived nearby today's Israel, few Arab regions and near Europe) and Ismael's clan called Bani-Ismael (lived nearby today's Arab including today's Palestine, Syria, Egypt, Israel, Yemen and Oman etc.). Both reaching to Prophet Abraham (Monotheism) family only., so, 1900 BC: Era of Abraham, Not only Father of the Jewish (Isaac) Nation but Arab (Ismael) Nation as well, prior to that, Abraham's successor were Saleh (Near Syria), Hud (Oman-Yemen), Noah (near Arab, Great flood), Idris (Younich, near Pyramid) and Adam (India / Arab).

    On earth life, Adam (almost 60 feet tall people those days, with 7000+ years history) from (Sri Lanka / India - his grave in Near Makkah) and Eve from Jeddah (Saudi Arabia - her grave near Jeddah) lived here (Indian continent) and there (Arab continent). Like GrandPa and GrandMa locations.

    Arafath (Arabic meaning is 'knowing each other', near Makkah (deserted, now city)) is the place where Adam and Eve met once again on the earth after the last one (Heaven - descendant), so, since long even before completion of the Islam (1400 years ago), those days people used to go Arafath place as a memory and pilgrims. Adam's generation passes from Makkah to today's Arab and Indian continent and sub-continents. Remember 7000+ years of history.

    Adam's sons (Abel and Cain) fought near today's Rameshwaram (TamilNadu) and the first murder happened on the earth. If you search or analyze, you would get his (longest) grave around there. There are many subjects in this till Jesus era.

    There were so many Prophets / Messengers (Rishis / Maharishis - around 1,24,000) that came as a reminder to humankind from time to time from Isaac's clan and few from Ismael's clan followed by natural destruction, like Dead sea area, Oman border, Harappa, Mohanjadaro and on. Still its glimpse comes from time to time. Whoever followed them in the past known as believers and whoever didn't follow disciplines (like Noah's one of the sons) became as non-believer. History repeats. Soul will come to know sooner or later even if the body does not.

    Adam's one of the sons is called Prophet Seth (which is also known as Ram-Sethu). Why the Canal project came in that exact location near Rameshwaram is an interesting one to find the history. Seth to replace Abel (in Rameshwaram).

    Ram or Ramses or Pharoah I or II etc. one of the highly respected titles for the King at that time.

    In case if history recalls human rights, then Red Indian and Native American only should be there in the USA. Only Adam's kids or followers must be there in India or around. Rest as you say. Whether we believe / agree or not, all reach to Adam / Eve.

  • #775598

    Points:1
    At the outset, I thank Hafeezur Rahman Sir for his scholarly response about the descendants of Abraham. I must admit that I didn't have so much information about Abraham and his descendants.

    Now, let me come to the latest response of Saji Sir. Those who are interested in history, know very well that Israel was created in 1948. Within a few days of its creation, the newly-created country's 'well-meaning' Arabian neighbours attacked the country in 1948-49. Thereafter one after another attack on this tiny country in 1956, 1967, 1969–70, 1973 (Yom Kippur War), and 1982 by coalition of Arabian countries. Is it Israel's fault that it defeated its extremely hostile group of neighbours?

    Those who know history also know about the terrible terrorist attack on Israeli athletes in 1972 Olympics held in Munich (Black September). They will never forget the dastardly terrorist attack by Hamas on unarmed Israeli and foreign civilians on 7th October 2023. Is it Israel's fault that it punishes those sub-humans?

    Then Saji Sir, who gives them (Arabian neighbours of Israel) the upperhand?

    Finally, let us all remember that at least some people from the opposite camp also study and clearly understand the chain of events.
    Billo Rani kahon to abhi jaan de doon: Oh dear Billo, if you ask, I will give my life

  • #775627

    Points:1
    As in every war, ordinary people suffer and many civilians die. And everything ends with a temporary lull.

  • #775660

      

    Points:5
    I just gave here less than one percent info out of hundred which is again less than zero point one percentage overall.

    I understand that incomplete or one sided info only circulates around for a long time through various sources (obviously one sided International News or understanding only one (English) language that generally many follow) without knowing the ground reality or history or either side's info.

    As Mark Twain says, If you don't read news(paper) then you will be uninformed and if you read news(paper) then you will be misinformed.

    Let's say, 1947, Pakistan was created but they slowly expanding or stealing India's land (saying bought it for better price) from Kashmir, HP, Punjab, Rajasthan, Gujarat etc. due to poor or powerless Government here, they says India and Afghan attacked Pak, and, Indian have to get all the document valid via Pakistan only (not from Govt. of India) even for travel/study/job, Pak armed guys daily tortures to those (kids/ladies) who go for pray near the border from India etc. beside blame that India initiated fight with Pak during this tenure and world media acknowledges it. For this reason, you and I don't fight for the nation or rights for the sake of a lack of knowledge of people around the world may tell both of us as 'Terrorist'. But our co-citizen is fighting against land stealers differently from time to time ignoring all.

    Have you seen any Arabian (not around Afghan / Iran / Mongol) specially Palestinian people who went to foreign land, killed or suppressed the historical native people (sub-human?) and claimed as their countries or freedom except trading / preaching (Ekam Brahma (sutra) - Monotheism and the history) and back to their great grandma's place?

    Hint: Software, Virus, Anti-virus, Hardware - all from one place. they would blame Virus part only to their opponent's creation and the world will believe it through their media.

    After some observation here, next, when I feel you guys are good or at least average or fair on National politics justification then I will assist you for Geo-Politics better understanding, or explain to you the History of existing human's 9 Avatars (and upcoming 10th Avatar (Gog Magog)) beside those who migrated back to today's India after Pharoh's (Maharishi Moses time 3000+ years) dynasty destruction and those migrators dominates / atrocities here even for those who came (before them) after Noah's (Manu - 5000 years) and Abraham (4000 years) time. So, imagine their superiority against the one who came after Moses era.

    In short, if you go by religion or location, Israel people stopped with Moses/David/Solomon (2500 years) whereas Palestinians continued with them, later following Jesus and Mohammed (as Muslim follow him as Anthim Rishi) in 4000+ years of history at the very same location.

  • #775662

    Points:1
    Out of station for a few days. Very poor internet connectivity. Will try to respond after returning to my base.
    Hope the response won't be deleted.
    Billo Rani kahon to abhi jaan de doon: Oh dear Billo, if you ask, I will give my life

  • #775675

    Points:1
    Little bit of history, especially for those who want to establish a Palestinian state kicking out all the Jews from the land of Israel:

    1. Before Israel, there was a British mandate, not a Palestinian state.

    2. Before the British Mandate, there was the Ottoman Empire, not a Palestinian state.

    3. Before the Ottoman Empire, there was an Islamic state of the Mamluks of Egypt, not a Palestinian state.

    4. Before the Islamic state of the Mamluks of Egypt, there was the Ayubid Arab-Kurdish Empire, not a Palestinian state.

    5. Before the Ayubid Empire, there was the Frankish and Christian Kingdom of Jerusalem, not a Palestinian state.

    6. Before the Kingdom of Jerusalem, there was Umayyad and Fatimid empires, again not a Palestinian state.

    7. Before the Umayyad and Fatimid empires, there was the Byzantine Empire, not a Palestinian state.

    8. Before the Byzantine Empire, there were the Sassanid Empire, not a Palestinian state.

    9. Before the Sassanid Empire, there was the Byzantine Empire, not a Palestinian state.

    10. Before the Byzantine Empire, there was the Roman Empire, not a Palestinian state.

    11. Before the Roman Empire, there was the Hasmonean state, not a Palestinian state.

    12. Before the Hasmonean state, there was the Seleucid, not a Palestinian state.

    13. Before the Seleucid Empire, there was the empire of Alexander the Great (Greek), not a Palestinian state.

    14. Before the empire of Alexander the Great, there was a Persian empire, not a Palestinian state.

    15. Before the Persian Empire, there was the Babylonian Empire, not a Palestinian state.

    16. Before the Babylonian Empire, there were the Kingdoms of Israel and Judah, not a Palestinian state.

    17. Before the Kingdoms of Israel and Judah, there was the Kingdom of Israel, not a Palestinian state.

    18. Before the kingdom of Israel, there was the theocracy of the twelve tribes of Israel, not a Palestinian state.

    19. Before the theocracy of the twelve tribes of Israel, there was an agglomeration of independent Canaanite city-kingdoms, not a Palestinian state.

    In actuality, in this piece of land which is known as Israel, there were lots of empires and civilizations, except a Palestinian state.
    Billo Rani kahon to abhi jaan de doon: Oh dear Billo, if you ask, I will give my life

  • #775676

    Points:5
    Partha's reasoning here is laughable and sad.

    The modern-day state of Israel is a settler colonist state established by the British. Despite the history of the Holocaust, it has itself pursued racism within its borders and it has taken the land that rightfully belongs to the native residents - the Palestinians.

    Insisting anything else would be Zionist propaganda, but Partha's assertions don't even reach that level.

    His insistence on deriving legitimacy of the Palestinian state through ancient history is emblematic of the rot that has set into our own country, where the people alive today matter far less than the people who lived and died thousands of years ago.

    It's fun to click through Wikipedia articles of political entities, I agree! I'm sure the Palestinians would be more than happy to read along with you, realise their ancestors don't belong on the land they're resident to because of the name they call themselves by, and then commit mass suicide so that the people with a different label can take over the land where they have lived.

    It's shameful that a place made for education like this allows and encourages a user who openly calls a group of people sub-human. It's obvious that you hate Muslims, Partha, no need to sugarcoat it with half-baked history lessons. Just say you want to genocide Muslims and move on.

  • #775677

      

    Points:5
    Partha,

    Someone made a wrong assumption. No Palestinian or Arab countries' would like to kick the the Jews from the land of today's Israel and they (Abraham/Moses/David/Solomon/Jacob/Joseph/Jerome/John etc. clan) have full rights to live there in (everyone proud of) on the officially allotted place that was already acknowledged) but since few decades few Israel kicks their own far powerless Palestinian from the officially allotted place and removing all their power to grab the land slowly and cleverly using the international power, weapon and media that's what the issue is creating by one. Like a brother is stealing another cousin brother's land with one sided story showing despite both registered for their separate places. Each innocents from either side feels threatened followed by.

    If so or accepting the history or the first one, or half-story like you stated, Adam or Hud or Saleh or Noah's family or their followers only should be in today's India (or only the first migraters of Noah (5500+ years migrators after Noah/Manu)) to India (which few already) and rest who came after Noah should be considered as your term now for Palestinians. Because no human on the earth before Adam (is Adim = meaning first & earth).

    Before Adam (created by creator from clay, blood and water etc.), Jinn (created from thick white smoke) were on earth and ruled it for 6000 years (with more tense / fight / murders than human histories) while the Universe was in process from God. That's why almost every religious scripture says the universe was created in God's 6 days (which is 6000 years for humans).

    FYI, Human's Israel land was created after Abraham's one of the great grandson clans. So, can you please furnish pre-Abraham era detail in the same listed way as well? (avoiding one side media news + copy pasting info that we see around in different sources) where there were neither Israel nor Palestine except both side dwellers (Sara / Hagira and other kids which already given the detail and prior them info as well, empires and civilization (now Palestinian)) with different name of the place for identification in different time.

  • #775680

    Points:1
    My response to Hafeezur Rahman Sir (#775677): "Someone made a wrong assumption. No Palestinian or Arab countries' would like to kick the the Jews from the land of today's Israel ......."

    Sir, in every major countries in Europe, Australia, North America and West Asia, nowadays we hear the slogan: ""From the (Jordan) River to the (Mediterranean) Sea, Palestine Will be Free".

    At the same time, in these demonstrations, they give vivid description of what they will do with the Jewish women after freeing the land.

    They have already provided practical demonstration of this aspect with the tortured, raped and naked dead body of unfortunate Shani Louk. And the reaction of thousands of 'innocent' Palestinians watching the naked dead body on the roads of Gaza tells everything about that freedom.

    Those who did this on 7th and 8th October 2023 on the roads of Gaza, unfortunately do not understand your view of brotherhood and also of the descendants of Abraham.

    Sir, please note that people do understand.

    Thank you.
    Billo Rani kahon to abhi jaan de doon: Oh dear Billo, if you ask, I will give my life

  • #775681

    Points:1
    Now let me come to the response given by Respected Krutika Madam (#775676).

    Respected Madam started with the remark: " Partha's reasoning here is laughable and sad."-----I congratulate myself. My writing prowess has caused such brilliant intermingling of two completely opposite emotions (laughter and sadness).

    Venerable Madam continued: "Insisting anything else would be Zionist propaganda, but Partha's assertions don't even reach that level." ------- Yes, Madam. Everything else is Zionist propaganda including the haunting images of (a) Shani Louk, the hapless German-Israeli Jewish girl who had been attending a music festival on the sacred day of 7th October, (b) and the charred deadbodies of young Israeli children, (c) and also the image of hapless child who was being baked while his mother was being repeatedly raped beside the deadbody of her husband, and (d) the images of complete and systematic destruction of Kibbutz Be'eri.

    Respected Madam continued: "His insistence on deriving legitimacy of the Palestinian state through ancient history is emblematic of the rot that has set into our own country, ........." -----So, no need of History education. Belittle and ridicule the history, culture, ethos and everything of the land. A ghoulish, morbid, stinking smell of rotten communism (with small c) enters my nostrils.

    (Will definitely continue later .....)
    Billo Rani kahon to abhi jaan de doon: Oh dear Billo, if you ask, I will give my life

  • #775683

      

    Points:5
    Partha,

    First of all, you have not given complete details that I asked a few and are trying to divert or pick one or one sided without either side's consequences. Ok, I will answer it despite you having given as little as half info.

    If Israel comes to do the same things to you or your nation then, is it okay for you? This land belongs to them as well, per history.

    Palestine Free means they need freedom within their area like we got freedom in India (1947) from outsider one. If Israel has already made Palestine powerless and shows Israel power in Palestine for a few decades like our country was going through before 1947 and earlier consequences then they will fight or slogan or protest. Understand that both sides have Anti and Pro slogans across the globe. You pluck one or one side to show it. Forbid, we will come to know if we go through this situation or else it is just a blah blah statement.

    We have India and Pakistan borders - both countries operate on their own even when conflict / tension / escalation happens. Pak or India can demo anything. Border issues can be seen in many states within nations and countries as well. Political one mostly.

    Here is a different story/ground reality. If any Palestinian wants to fly outside the country then Israel has to validate it now for them, like if an Indian wants to fly to the foreign countries then I have to get validation from Pakistan instead of India. Like that so many things you may not be aware of or ignore or hide except showing one side picture and what can we expect.

    If they got freedom from Israel then how can they continue freedom-fight again or slogan or cross the border for what you say or demo instead of improving or concentrating their life? Do India or Pak do vice-versa, like (fake/real) Demos and cross the limit and capture the nation in real?

    In fact many poor Palestinians with Israeli permits were working in Israel companies / locations. Not vice-versa.

    The Palestinians actually know more than me and they actually want their own country with their own power, not Israel's power in Palestine. Israel can show its power to its own or to superior than them for whatever or weapon business. Not a poor country who still has to struggle for the freedom of their own in 2022-23 or 2023-24 just for the sake of the fact that they are the only who accepted and sold limited land to Israelis after Hitler issues. Many know a bit of history earlier and after.

    Even though you are aware that Tit for Tat is happening there, you are still showing one side to us. Whoever has done on 7th is not the right one. Before 7th also the super-power was done to poor, that's how earlier consequences hid?

    Whenever conflict happens anywhere in the world (Israel-Palestine) or locally (Manipur), if people know it then they never go one sided but try to know either side to avoid cheating self-conscience or regret later.

  • #775685

    Points:1
    This is in response to the latest comment of Hafcezur Rahman Sir (#775683).

    1. The next day of the dastardly attack by Hamas on unarmed Israeli civilians including small children and unarmed women (which the liberals are trying their best to push under the carpet), Israeli PM Benjamin Netanyahu clearly declared without any uncertain term that the Israeli response will be asymmetric and will continue for a long time.
    2. Incidentally Benjamin Netanyahu is the younger brother of Solomon Netanyahu, the hero of Israel's Operation Thunderbolt.. Solomon Netanyahu was the team captain of the elite Israeli commandos who rescued the kidnapped passengers and crew of the hijacked plane from Uganda (at a distance of more than 3500 km). The team saved almost all hostages but Solomon Netanyahu died by a stray bullet at the time of evacuation, as he was the last person to enter the Israeli plane. (Incidentally my first writing which was appreciated, was on Operation Thunderbolt, when I was a student of VIIIth Standard way back in 1980). If Benjamin Netanyahu preached the sermon of peace after the Hamas attack, the soul of his elder brother would be in terrible pain.
    3. Even then, Israel gave time to the civilians of Gaza to leave and shift to South Gaza within 24 hours. I feel this is a humanitarian gesture. The Hamas militants didn't allow the civilians to relocate.
    4. The Hamas sub-humans use the civilians as shield to get protected from Israeli retaliations. This is not a recent phenomenon, it is being noticed for at least last 20 years. This time also, these sub-humans took shelter in a hospital among the wounded patients. The hospital has been severely damaged due to malfunctioning of a Hamas rocket, for which the so-called liberals blamed the IDF.
    5. Just now, I have read that several Hamas terrorists tried to flee to Egypt in two UN ambulances. The IDF got the info and destroyed one ambulance, for which again Israel is blamed by all and sundry. The top bosses of Hamas are enjoying life in Oman, Qatar and other middle-eastern countries, while the people of Gaza are dying.
    6. Immediately after formation of Israel state, all the Arabian countries attacked the just-born state in 1947-48. Was the attack for peaceful co-existence? Were the consequent attacks on Israel in 1956, 1967, 1969–70, 1973 (Yom Kippur War), and 1982 by coalition of Arabian countries for establishing peaceful relation? Is it Israel's fault that it defeated its extremely hostile group of neighbours every time?
    7. The countless terrorist attacks by erstwhile PLA, Hejbollah from West Bank and Hamas from Gaza are perhaps for peaceful co-existence of Israelis Palestinians. And it is Israel's fault to find out the terrorists and eliminate them systematically in a ruthless manner!
    8. After the terrible 7th October, even 95-year old Ezra Yachin has again taken up gun. 20 -year old young girl 2nd Lt. Adar Ben Simon killed 10 beasts, saved civilians and herself became martyr for the cause of Israel. 25 year old woman Inbal Rabin-Lieberman fought like a lioness and saver her Kibbutz Nir Am. Captain (Res.) Sagi Golan joined the fight without being summoned by the country, ferociously fought to save Kibbutz Be'eri and got killed only before three days of his marriage. There are many such saga of heroics (You may read the details from my posts in another site). Who can defeat such people with indomitable spirit? Those Hamas sub-humans?
    9. Now, even one after another Muslim countries have come out to support Israel in its fight against terrorists in Gaza. The western nations are openly supporting Israel.. And even India, which earlier blindly supported PLA and did not establish diplomatic relations with Israel for the sake of voters from a particular community, is supporting Israel.
    10. Finally, who will answer this question? If all Palestinians are not Hamas supporters, then how did Hamas come to power in Gaza in the year 2006 and is continuing to rule Gaza since then?
    Billo Rani kahon to abhi jaan de doon: Oh dear Billo, if you ask, I will give my life

  • #775686

    Points:1
    Now, let me go back to Respected Krutika Madam's erudite response at #775676.

    Respected Madam stated in that response: "It's shameful that a place made for education like this allows and encourages a user who openly calls a group of people sub-human. It's obvious that you hate Muslims, Partha, no need to sugarcoat it with half-baked history lessons."

    1. I humbly submit that today's fashion is to term Truth as Islamophobia. Those who speak Unpalatable Truth or present irrefutable logic are called Islamophobics. Madam Krutika is also very fashion-conscious in that sense.
    2. However, Respected Madam must not blame this website. It is for her information that this educational website has tried many times to discipline this 'unruly child'. The website has punished this 'incorrigible man' several times with hope that this man would change his terribly incorrect world view. But the Editors of this website have not been successful in this regard so far.

    Finally, Venerable Krutika Madam opined: "Just say you want to genocide Muslims and move on."---------What can I say in this regard? As a son of refugee parents who came to this part of divided India as penniless paupers leaving everything, I can only say that despite getting the lesson of loving everyone and not to discriminate anyone on the basis of religion/caste/region, I always keep my eyes and ears open and take decision or form my opinion according to the circumstances/hard facts. I am not an ostrich burying my head in the sand to ward off danger.
    Billo Rani kahon to abhi jaan de doon: Oh dear Billo, if you ask, I will give my life

  • #775692

      

    Points:5
    Still not complete info of Pre-Abraham era and 1948 around.

    Why did you hide the info of 'newly created Israel' occupied the neighbors countries border and beyond that they had to get back after stated War consequences but unfortunate Palestine and consequences as of now?

    Tell good about me and hide my bad, and, tell bad about others and hide their good. Political gimmicks won't work with some.

    It seems that considering your logic already or sooner you support and say whatever Pakistan is doing against India is correct and some may accept you that India had sub-human upon freedom fights and on.

    I suggest you to listen Mr. Vajpayee's video available or Mr. Jaishankar's recent statement on this conflicts.

    Considering one side info or hidden intention of many fact of either sides, I feel to avoid this thread henceforth.

    Karma returns to everyone after allotted and affixed time is over.

  • #775693

    Points:1
    This is in reply to the last response of Hafeezur Rahman Sir.

    (a) Rahman Sir has said: "Why did you hide the info of 'newly created Israel' occupied the neighbors countries border and beyond that they had to get back after stated War consequences but unfortunate Palestine and consequences as of now?"-------------In this connection, I would like to quote some of my favourite quotes of David Ben-Gurion, the first PM of the newly-created nation-state Israel. He said:
    (i) "Israel has created a new image of the Jew in the world - the image of a working and an intellectual people, of a people that can fight with heroism."
    (ii) "Suffering makes a people greater, and we have suffered much. We had a message to give the world, but we were overwhelmed, and the message was cut off in the middle. In time there will be millions of us - becoming stronger and stronger - and we will complete the message."
    Later Ms. Golda Meir, Menachem Begin, Yitzhak Rabin, Benjamin Netanyahu and other Israeli leaders have clearly stated many a times: "Israel has no option to lose; The country must win against its enemies to survive".
    Israel is precisely doing so. It destroys, annihilates the enemy/enemies which attack(s) the country.

    (b) After every war which I mentioned earlier, Israel occupied enemy land as a punishment but also from a strategic point of view. The occupied territories caused maximum danger to the sovereignty of Israel.

    (c) But, at the same time, Israel also returned some earlier occupied territories to those countries which denounced enmity with Israel. How can we forget the historic Camp David Accords between Anwar Sadat of Egypt and Menachem Begin of Israel? Didn't Israel return earlier-occupied Sinai peninsula to Egypt, when it realised that Egypt had renounced the path of enmity with Israel?

    (d) Again, the old question. If all Palestinians are not Hamas supporters, then how did Hamas come to power in Gaza in the year 2006 and is continuing to rule Gaza since then?

    (e) At the end, my own question. The so-called Palestine-supporters consciously avoid this question. What should Israel do if it does not retaliate against the Hamas beasts? Allow these beasts to kill more people including old and babies, allow these beasts to rape young girls and display their dead bodies on the road, allow them to destroy human habitations created in the desert by hard labour of thousands of people?
    Will the so-called liberals answer?
    Billo Rani kahon to abhi jaan de doon: Oh dear Billo, if you ask, I will give my life

  • #775694

      

    Points:5
    I would be the last person to justify any terror attacks or brutal wars but one doubt that is worrying me is as to why there is a onesided sympathy? The terror attack on Israel by Hamas needs to be condemned and there is no doubt about that but why try to justify the Israel attacks? It is human beings that are being mercilessly killed on both the sides. Why is there an attempt to justify Israel's inhuman conduct of bombing hospitals and refugee camps? Is the brutal attacks by Israel on innocent Palestenians justified? Reports suggest that Israel is very well aware about the locations of Hamas camps. If that be the case, with the advancement in technology, why are they not targetting the terrorist camps primarily? Israel has always been laying a claim on Palestine. Did the attack on Israel by Hamas give them an opening to have their way? Have international laws and treaties been flouted?

    If we are to go by History as claimed by a section, then we will have to redo so many things starting from the time human civilisation came into existence. So I don't think it would be logical to dig into the past if we expect to live in peace.

    Note: I would request learned Partha to please avoid personal attacks. If you can have your say, so can others.
    'Educating the mind without educating the heart is no education at all'.
    -Aristotle

  • #775695

    Points:1
    I am totally disheartened by the last response of Saji Sir. I have a feeling that whatever I stated earlier on this issue for so many days have fallen on deaf ears.

    (a) "I would request learned Partha to please avoid personal attacks. If you can have your say, so can others."-------------------I re-read my responses. When have I made personal attacks? Instead I salute Hafeezur Rahman Sir for his scholarly and informative responses. By the way, can a permanent back-bencher be addressed as 'learned'? Please read my profile: "Qualifications: Barely literate. Joined ISC to learn from erudite members."

    (b) "If we are to go by History as claimed by a section, then we will have to redo so many things starting from the time human civilisation came into existence."----------If the Palestinians really want a two-state solution, then why this slogan: "From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free"? If the slogan becomes true, then where would the Jews go?

    (c) "Reports suggest that Israel is very well aware about the locations of Hamas camps. If that be the case, with the advancement in technology, why are they not targetting the terrorist camps primarily?"---------As an ex-militaryman, he must be knowing that the Hamas camps are mobile and these terrorists always make civilians as shields to protect themselves from Israeli attacks. This is happening for the last twenty-five years.

    (d) "Why is there an attempt to justify Israel's inhuman conduct of bombing hospitals and refugee camps? "-------- We all now know that the hospital was damaged due to a misdirected rocket attack by the Hamas terrorists themselves. The terrorists are now hiding in the refugee camps and hospitals amongst the civilians.

    (e) Farther, if the civilians are so innocent, then why did they have surch perverse pleasure when the naked deadbody of the raped Jewish woman was being displayed on the Gaza roads? Why have they been voting for Hamas since 2006?

    (f) "......why there is a onesided sympathy?"----------Since the time of Nehru till the time of Narasimha Rao, why did liberals turn a blind eye to the terror attacks and killing of Israelis? Indians also did the same and provided all support to PLA and its offshoots due to convoluted ideology of the Nehruvian era. But even then, Israel offered their help without any publicty at the time of crisis of India.

    Saji Sir, please read my main post and subsequent responses again.
    Billo Rani kahon to abhi jaan de doon: Oh dear Billo, if you ask, I will give my life

  • #775696

      

    Points:5
    Israel has full rights to live there where it was officially allotted at that time. In fact nobody is disturbing Israel since the new one unless Israel disturbs the neighbor countries first that's what is happening but showing otherwise. You got tortured somewhere (German) and to heal you are torturing a different one (Palestine) which is beyond their capacity.

    When you get blood then it is a blood and when others get blood then it is just a tomato ketchup.

    The second one is, Israel is the first one who grabs the neighbor countries land and when the neighbors come back to get it through negotiation or last option of war then they become the enemy. Creating Friend to Enemy by Israel first then showing the world via one sided media differently. Suppress the other side of the media. Let me correct Partha, first occupy the land, and negotiation / war happens and not vice-versa as you stated (war then occupy the land) smartly to twist it.

    The occupied territories caused maximum danger to the sovereignty of 'not' only Israel but almost every country's statement across the globe. So, if every nation that was created around the 1940s follows the Israel pattern (to survive with sovereignty) then there will be problems / wars across the globe. Do you plan or want it as such for weapon business to kill innocent people for your superiority or primary position and dirty politics?

    Again I wanted to ask the afore-mentioned question in my reply. However, Palestinian or Hamas was demanding for many years about the prison release that was captured (a few years and decade ago) by Israel, till 7th. Hardly few say their demand and detail but show a different one. How can an Indian citizen (not Indian Army etc.) considered as a threat can be captured by China and put them in Prison for a decade plus, like happens in border areas for a short time normally?

    My question to Israel supporters. What should Palestine do if it doesn't fight for its own basic rights that were taken away within their own land after new Israel was created?

    Sometimes an inside job happens (opposing one within a group's execution plan) and the world or innocent thinks that it would have been done by its enemy. Few Afghan clips came like that only an innocent world believed it for orchestra one. Finally the Afghan too got Freedom and ran the show on their own.

    All in all, your one sided statement also supports Pakistan sovereignty's purpose to do the same for its surrounding enemies to survive?

    In general, if Gasoline dried up for a few decades then everything would be normal or better than the situation right now. Leave the sovereignty in bin and move to greenery one (Europe and on) and rest the Desert generation live alone over there happily as usual that everyone can't do it (even me hard to live in Desert with six months severe cold and hot without AC arrangement), moreover, greenery area people can create another World war over there and come back when Gasoline or other rich natural source available in desert.

    No personal yet from Partha. Appreciate Partha for bringing in partial info at least (History is also a study subject), and it was not my topic or thread to enter but just observed a few things when I got little time, and replied accordingly.


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